bombs in london

Post by **hubird** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 5:21 pm

On 2005-07-07 15:57, dArKr3zIn wrote:
Personally I make no distinction between western economic fascism and islamic fascism.

I know what you mean, but I wouldn't hussle both fenomenons to one 'fascism'.

Fascism is a historically defined term, there are better words for economic fascism, like economic colonization, or imperialism.

These terms sound bad enough, and they're more clear in analytic sense.

To understand the differences between both forms of 'fascism', that's the real challenge, if you wanne solve the problem.

World poverty as a consequence of the way the G8 countries and friends rule the 'free' market is exactly the subject that should have been dominating the news these days.
Anyone out there who's still talking about Life8?

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: hubird on 2005-07-07 18:27 ]</font>

Me$$iah · Post by **Me$$iah** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 5:27 pm

The cynic in me wonders

'First the olymics then this. How far will these people go to deflect attention from the G8 ant their adgenda'

my best wishes to all in London.
dont let the gov use this to impose ID cards or other erosions of freedom

-Me$$iah

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 5:56 pm

On 2005-07-07 10:20, garyb wrote:

"terrorist groups", "freedom fighters" if you will, are just one of the statisically known and proven by-products of terrorism. they are planned upon and accounted for in insurance. on the highest levels they are depended upon.

there will likely be an automatic, conditioned negative response on some level to this rant

"Depended upon at the highest levels" ?

Are you implying that western agencies did the bombing or somehow 'look forward' to them ? I think militant student newsletters in Iran would hestitate before making that silly claim.

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:03 pm

On 2005-07-07 11:26, dArKr3zIn wrote:
I simply believe that this bogeyman known as 'Al Qaeda' is funded by world banks whose aim is not only to enslave the 3rd world, but also us here in the cosy and safe 'developed' world.

So the banks are funding Islamic fascism and terrorism in order to enslave the world ? Which banks might they be ?

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:11 pm

On 2005-07-07 18:27, Me$$iah wrote:
The cynic in me wonders

'First the olymics then this. How far will these people go to deflect attention from the G8 ant their adgenda'

So are you thinking that some Western agencies planted these bombs to divert attention from the G8 meeting ? Exactly to what use will this "diversion of attention" be put ?

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:31 pm

On 2005-07-07 11:00, braincell wrote:
Okay from what I hear about 30 or 40 people were killed. In Washington DC between 200-300 people are murdered each and every year. Hey but we are expected to kill ourselves, however if a foreigner kills us it makes the world news. You are just as dead either way. It is all about fear or foreigners. The publicity is blown way out of proportion which is to be expected when there is interest and the media can attract more viewers and get more money.

Let's just say you were running a large media organisation. Please enlighten me as to what your top three stories of today would be ?

edit: And if you knew anything at all about the way the media industry works you'd know that events like this often mean media organisations lose money. Many print advertisers do not want their products associated or displayed in the midst of tragic news. TV ads booked to run in certain programs are cancelled because of the extended news coverage, or again because of their placement in tragic events.

In print, newspapers will often drop large ads in order to get more space for editorial items. They will also often increase the print run due to an expected increase in sales. However, this does NOT increase revenue - it decreases revenue because only a constant editorial-to-ad ratio covers the extra print costs. The cover price alone does not cover the extra print run costs.

Media increase revenue by controlled increases in ad placements. One-off news event "spikes" are not revenue generators.
_________________

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Spirit on 2005-07-07 19:44 ]</font>

Me$$iah · Post by **Me$$iah** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:45 pm

this 'diveresion' is going to be used a a call to bring in ID cards and probably more CCTV, even tho London is the most camerad city in the world.
Also with Live8 included with everything else Kyoto, for example, is very low on peoples list of expectations.
I dont trust governments its not like theyve never lied before or even attacked their own peoples. As far back as Nero burning Rome or Hitler bombing the Reichstag to the Bay of Tomkin incident, fear has always been used to control population and pass draconian laws
Not that Im saying 'the gov did it.. the gov dit it' it could be a home grown Al Queda cell or even an out of touch disenfranchised remnant of the IRA (tho an islamic site is claiming responsiblity) But Ill bet that the British government will use this to help pass their terror laws
And thus divert attention from other issues like climate AIDS WMF etc.... see even I got carried away on a terrorism thing

No offence meant to anyone, I new here and really dont want to start off by upsetting people and making enemies here.

-Me$$iah

Post by **garyb** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 7:16 pm

the banking connections are VERY easily found, if one would like to check into it. hint: check saudi arms dealers with connections to the russell trust....

mussolini defined facism thusly: " it is more properly called corporatism as it is a blend of corporate and state power."

moosethree · Post by **moosethree** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 7:21 pm

Lets see the G8 was meeting to discuss billions of aid to Africa... quite conspiratorial....and of course the press is excited about getting off that Olympics story and covering terrorism so they can "blow it out of proportion"...I hope if your family member dies you don't blow it out of proportion...gee we're going to all die anyway, why get so upset. Lets all go to an Al Queda sympathizing Mosque and sing cum baya.Islamic Fascism is not as good as being a secret conspiracy as the G8...they just say outright they want to take the world by the sword and you will be a radical Moslem or they will kill you. Period. Like they are doing in Sudan...right now. Oh yeah that conspiratorial US saved millions of Moslem lives in Kosovo stopping a genocide by hmmm
non-moslems....silly Americans they get so confused in their conspiratoriality.

moosethree · Post by **moosethree** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 7:33 pm

That you say the G8 democracies have caused world poverty by their free market is insane.
Totally insane. It is real political delusion of the highest order. Like parasites you attack the system from which you profit and gives you the freedom to despise it openly. What non capitalist system is providing 30 billion in aid to africa..not counting the huge sums of private money going to third world nations daily from those living under this conspiratorial regime? and what form of socialism are you wishing to replace it with?

Nestor · Post by **Nestor** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 9:10 pm

I'm so sorry for you people there... I love England! I don't know what to say really, it's terrible!

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 9:14 pm

On 2005-07-07 20:16, garyb wrote:
the banking connections are VERY easily found, if one would like to check into it. hint: check saudi arms dealers with connections to the russell trust....

mussolini defined facism thusly: " it is more properly called corporatism as it is a blend of corporate and state power."

I don't doubt that you can find connections between banks and all sorts of causes, religions, crackpots & dictators. Swiss banks have always been a favourite of the corrupt.

But it's a very long distance bewteen that and saying that banks actively sponsor terrorism.

And I think it's more likely that it would be terrorists playing a big financial game here. They'd have to be aware of the financial implications of a major attack on a country, and skew their 'fronted' investments accordingly.

Post by **garyb** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 11:49 pm

it's one big system.
this is not a subjective emotional statement. it's factual. it IS one big system. the police need the theives to justify their existance. the idea is not protection, justice, togetherness. it is suffering and punishment. my way or the highway. obviously, nothing else works.

the encyclodedia brittanica told me that nimrod instituted the "system of government that rules through random acts of violence"(he was know as "the mighty hunter". a constellation was named after him. he got his name by hunting men.). indeed this babylonian system still reigns. rule is still through "ransom acts of violence. the current order is known to be corrupt(i'm not talking about ideologies, but the entire order). all new world orders offered are the same. they promise to protect from these random acts of violence. it's the same game that the mafia runs, all of this system works the same.

the solution? a change of mind. a different way of seeing reality. with the present mindset, horror and suffering must result. it's systematic. reprogram or die. there is a virus running and the cpu can't tell the difference between the corrupt script and the proper one.....

"police and theives in the streeet, oh yeah.
frighten the nation with their guns and ammunition."

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 3:19 am

Spirit - I wish I could be as blissfully naive as you when it come sto world affairs. Unfortunately I can't stand by, close down my senses and repeat to myself that everything is okay. Because it really is not.

We enslave the developing world so we can live comfortably and wear nice shoes. Does this not make you feel rather disgusted? Are we that de-sensitized to this sheer injustice in the world? Do we really think that going to a charity concert is 'doing our bit' to help the planet?

First of all, living in London, I cannot begin to be shocked or surprised at what has happened here. Our troops have played their part in killing 100,000+ Iraqi citizens, most of which I would lay my life down to say were innocent and didn't ask for that. This figure dwarfs the number killed in the NewYork, Madrid and London attacks. But hang on, why is the life of a dirty Arab somehow less worthy than a white American/European?

Why do we have the right to throw our weight around and inflict our system (which is known to have severe problems) on a culturally different people? You may have run into trouble with Saddam Hussein if you tried to be political in Iraq, but at least you could live a pretty normal family life on the whole (well, within the bounds of UN sanctions), without the daily risk of getting sniped or blown up.

Without wanting to trivialize the deaths and injuries yesterday, the London bombs were a walk in the park compared to what happens in Iraq on a daily basis.

Have a look at who manufactures arms for both sides. Look at the awarding of construction contracts in Iraq. Then ask yourself who are the real winners in this 'war on terror'.

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 3:26 am

It seems no bomb men, no suicides in this attack.
jihad is "evolving"?

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 3:31 am

And garyb is absolutely right about a Babylonian sadistic ethos being in operation, within the highest echelons of power. People like Alex Jones and David Icke may make these things seem sensational, but what they're saying has been clearly acknowledged for many years. The Rockefellers/Rothchilds have, let's face it, been running things for many many years (David Rockefeller was even special adviser to several presidents, I believe). Mr. Rockefeller also had a factory churning out ammunition for *both sides* in the Vietnam war. These are just a few examples.. feel free to dig deeper, you'll find that the rabbit holes go to the same place.

What I find disturbing is that, to point out that these banking systems are killing our planet is somehow seen as anti-semitic. This is an unfortunate whitewash because godless sadists like the Rockefellers do not represent Jewish people... it would be as stupid and ignorant as saying that all muslims are murderous fundamentalist lunatics because of the actions of a few idiots.

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 3:40 am

On 2005-07-07 19:11, Spirit wrote:
So are you thinking that some Western agencies planted these bombs to divert attention from the G8 meeting ? Exactly to what use will this "diversion of attention" be put ?

Spirit, is it not obvious? What do you think is going to be more important to our debauched, selfish society:

1. eradicating a manufactured terror threat

2. helping Africa and our planet's environment which we fucked up beyond all comprehension for the sake of sheer greed

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 3:57 am

dArKr3zIn it must be quite frustrating for you then to live in this terrible 'debauched and selfish' society.

I'm very interested to know what other societies are around today that come closer to your ideal ? Are there some particular countries you could name ?

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 3:59 am

On 2005-07-08 00:49, garyb wrote:
it's one big system.
this is not a subjective emotional statement. it's factual. it IS one big system. the police need the theives to justify their existance. the idea is not protection, justice, togetherness. it is suffering and punishment.

Well, academically interesting I suppose, but hardly a real-world plan of action or solution. Is there anything concrete that goes along with such sentiment ?

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 4:11 am

On 2005-07-07 19:31, Spirit wrote:
On 2005-07-07 11:00, braincell wrote:
Okay from what I hear about 30 or 40 people were killed. In Washington DC between 200-300 people are murdered each and every year. Hey but we are expected to kill ourselves, however if a foreigner kills us it makes the world news. You are just as dead either way. It is all about fear or foreigners. The publicity is blown way out of proportion which is to be expected when there is interest and the media can attract more viewers and get more money.
Let's just say you were running a large media organisation. Please enlighten me as to what your top three stories of today would be ?

edit: And if you knew anything at all about the way the media industry works you'd know that events like this often mean media organisations lose money. Many print advertisers do not want their products associated or displayed in the midst of tragic news. TV ads booked to run in certain programs are cancelled because of the extended news coverage, or again because of their placement in tragic events.

In print, newspapers will often drop large ads in order to get more space for editorial items. They will also often increase the print run due to an expected increase in sales. However, this does NOT increase revenue - it decreases revenue because only a constant editorial-to-ad ratio covers the extra print costs. The cover price alone does not cover the extra print run costs.

Media increase revenue by controlled increases in ad placements. One-off news event "spikes" are not revenue generators.
_________________

I don't think media increase gain, but the space reserved to news like this is surely excessive. All the other news disappear or are just mentioned, outlined, smothered by this great echo for the next weeks.