A bit of a linux audio breakthrough

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 10:40 pm

I've been persistent with linux, using it for daily websurfing, fooling around to see if I can put together a linux based flash programming environment, etc.. things have been working very well apart from the sub par audio situation.

Well, the magic word seems to be "wineasio". Wine is a collection of open source versions of the standard windows dll set, which allows win apps to run almost natively in linux. wineasio is a driver that shows up as an asio device in the virtual windows environment, and hooks up to jack audio server (that controls low latency audio on linux side). So basically it hooks up virtual windows to jack on a low latency bus. This allows me to run vst based audio apps in virtual windows, and route all output to linux side.

I ran Reaper for a bit, just messing with the default project (couple of wav tracks) adding vst effects here and there. It was all running great, using very low cpu, at 11ms latency on the onboard soundblaster clone. I tried Reaper because it seems to be the sequencer of choice with wineasio in terms of stability. (according to a bunch of forums I read through)

While it's kind of dumb to run vst hosts in Wine, it allows you to route asio output to linux, and process audio even further if you choose to. Also, provided that wineasio is stable, it allows you to run the vst host in a fat free environment with less extra background tasks that may lead to more stability. (just guessing) I'll try a couple of different hosts and see how it goes.

Lima · Post by **Lima** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 3:10 am

Really interesting Ken! I follow your linux attempts with great interest because I'm also evolving to the linux enviroment.
Actually I use linux for net surfing and for school. I use wine to run a couple of programs made by my professors under Windows. I didn't know the WineAsio solution and I thank you to have pointed me to it.

I also have tried Qemu to run some audio programs but this way is a bit tricky expecially for the kind of soundcard emulation.

Do you know if it wineasio is interfaceable with Ardour in any way?

dawman · Post by **dawman** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 5:01 am

I am very interested in what you are doing.

Please keep us posted w/ your findings.

Especially the issues of stability.

Zer · Post by **Zer** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 6:16 am

try renoise

The Linux version includes the following features:
* ALSA support (for Audio and MIDI)
* JACK Audio support (optional)
* LADSPA support (native Linux audio plugins)
* Native Linux VST support

To help you get Renoise up and running on your Linux box, there is
a Linux FAQ.
http://tutorials.renoise.com/Renoise/SettingUpLinux

You can also visit the Linux forum section for all your questions,
experiences and suggestions.
http://www.renoise.com/board/index.php?showforum=34

Jack audio:

http://jackaudio.org/download

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 6:32 am

the neat thing with wineasio is that since it get the audio to jack (sort of like rewire for linux), you can route asio to wherever you want from there, as long as the linux side program supports jack. (not 100% standard, but many of them support jack)

still haven't figured out how to increase asio channels tho, so currently I only see a 1ch of stereo in and out.

Also, I read that newer versions of LMMS (sequencer that runs in linux) supports win vsti, but you have to compile it yourself. All this stuff it tricky because it's touches on the subject of "only packaging open source code" on distributions. Since most of them require the VST sdk, you have to compile them on your own. (so, the executable form is never distributed)

LMMS is a little strange.. the guy reverse engineered the VST structure, and got it to work. So it's a little different than using Steinberg's VST sdk.. still I couldn't find a ready to go package anywhere.

Zer, Renoise only does linux VST right? Or it does win VST out of the box?

Zer · Post by **Zer** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:14 pm

kensuguro wrote:the neat thing with wineasio is that since it get the audio to jack (sort of like rewire for linux), you can route asio to wherever you want from there, as long as the linux side program supports jack. (not 100% standard, but many of them support jack)

still haven't figured out how to increase asio channels tho, so currently I only see a 1ch of stereo in and out.

Also, I read that newer versions of LMMS (sequencer that runs in linux) supports win vsti, but you have to compile it yourself. All this stuff it tricky because it's touches on the subject of "only packaging open source code" on distributions. Since most of them require the VST sdk, you have to compile them on your own. (so, the executable form is never distributed)

LMMS is a little strange.. the guy reverse engineered the VST structure, and got it to work. So it's a little different than using Steinberg's VST sdk.. still I couldn't find a ready to go package anywhere.

Zer, Renoise only does linux VST right? Or it does win VST out of the box?

Unfortunately I didn`t test it on linux myself. But the win version operates with win vsts out of the box. Most questions are probabaly solved within the faq

Lima · Post by **Lima** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:29 am

Zer, are you another sick Renoise user?
I'm a Renoise user since the days of Beat Battle 1...

I don't have tested the tracker under linux yet, because I've got few spare time and because for the "serious" tasks I need some win prgs and my belowed Scope, but thanks for the head up!

Zer · Post by **Zer** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:33 am

yeah I like renoise. The only tracker where I found a steady development. But it's not the only program I use.

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 9:57 pm

so I tried doing some work on Reaper through wineasio, and the performance is shaky. The MIDI routing from Jack into the window environment is fine, and I can play VSTis in reaper with 11ms latency. Haven't gone lower, but that's good for what it is. Anyway, the problem is that I get sudden crashes on Reaper, once in the 3 hours that I've worked with it today... Can't say whether it's an issue between Reaper and the specific plugin (some freeware phaser).. Also, I initially had some trouble where Reaper would loose contact with the asio device, but "rechoosing" the device in the asio setup window would revive it.

Anyway, my initial impression is very mixed. While it's running, it runs almost flawless, but that sudden crash worries me. Will keep messing with it. At least I got 1 of the 5 sounds I needed to make (2 second sound logo) in 3 hours.