PCI-master-overflow

An area for people to discuss Scope related problems, issues, etc.

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steffensen
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Post by steffensen »

I know this have been brought up before, but i still havent found a solution in any of the posts regarding this matter.

I just bought a XTC Pulsar 2 card, and have connected it to my other Pulsar 2 card with 2 S/TDM cables. In SFP i see my Pulsar 2 card as the Host one, and the XTC card as #2, all good.

I know i could load 8 MasterVerbs before on only my Pulsar 2 card, so i spose i should be able to load at least 15-16 MV's now, with the double DSP. This is not the case however..

As soon as i get over 8, sometimes 12 (this sort of happens randomly whenever i get over 8 instances), i get the PCI-master-overflow Error. (PCI capacity limit reached, etc..)

One other thing, dunno if its relevant or not, but anyway..
When i open dxdiag to change the gfx acceleration i get this strange error, wich i i didnt get before this new card was plugged in. "Error: Problem getting extra sound info, result code = 0x80004005 (Generic failure)"

My setup consist of:
Mobo: A7N8X-E Deluxe
(http://uk.asus.com/products4.aspx?model ... 2=13&l3=56)
CPU: AMD Athlon+ 3200
Graphic card: Matrox G550

Ive done these tweaks:
- Disabled graphic acceleration
- Disabled bus mastering on my gfx card
- Tried to put the new card on other PCI slots
- Display properties, 16bit
- Added the line "[mga.drv]PCIChipset=1" to the system.ini file, as its recomended in the support section of the manual

none of the above tweaks made any difference, other than slowing down my computer..

So i plea to you guys, please say there is any chance for me to use my new DSP's, to get this thing working like its sposed to.

There must be /something/ i can do?
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astroman
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Post by astroman »

your problem is entirely related to the PCI performance of the chipset, and afai remember the NForce2 doesn't reach the Intel chipsets or Nforce3 (as recently reported).

If you have 8 reliable MVs in a full project it isn't that bad, more than 15 absolutely require a top chipset and optimized setup - you probably don't want to dedicate the board to MVs exclusively anyway.

In this case it's up to you to decide if a mobo change applies - if you want some of the more demanding reverbs like MV-Pro or the STW 100 series than you MUST change the mobo.

at least you don't have a messed installation (imho)

sorry for the inconvenience, Tom
steffensen
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Post by steffensen »

Thanks for the fast reply!

I kinda figured it had to be some kind of Chipset problem, but thats were more a guess that anything else.

But ok, guess i can live with this til its time for a new computer then. I dont really use more than 2-3 MV's anyway, so if i can use the DSP to 100% with other stuff, its perfectly fine.

Actually, i just did a test by adding as many voices as possible on the Pro-12, and then i could max my DSP full out.

Anyways, thanks a lot for confirming my thoughts and making things clearer for me.
Now i know my options a bit better. :smile:
musurgio
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Post by musurgio »

hI,
you can change the row of your cards that scope sees them which most of the time solves these problems.

Put in the very beginning of cset.ini file in your bin folder, just back it up in case you mess up with it..
[board0]
boardid=1
[board1]
boardid=0

If that doesn't change the way Scope sees your cards just change the 0 with 1 and the opposite.
Hope this helps
Regards,
Dimitrios
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Shroomz~>
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Post by Shroomz~> »

Hi, the motherboard & chipset you have are absolutely fine. There should be absolutely no need to change it unless you're sure it's broke or for some reason need more native performance.

We have the A7N8X-Deluxe (not 'E') which is essentially the same motherboard (same chipsets) We have 12 dsps too, but in a different config' (6+3+3 connected via one STDM ) cable. We get 14 MV's error free & on loading No.15 run out of DSP before getting a PCI error. See <a href="http://www.planetz.com/forums/viewtopic ... 0">HERE</a> Now this is where diagnosis becomes difficult & exactly why I started a thread a while back intended to gather info on peoples' STDM configs... (which amazingly a few people thought was a stupid idea)

problems making a comparison between our rigs :-

a)you've got 6+6 connected via 2 cables which could definately make a difference, although this hasn't been confirmed or proven as far as I know.

b)Your mobo although essentially the same, has an additional feature & also shipped with a newer bios than we're running, so that's a slightly grey area.

c)You're using a different graphics card. We have an NVidea FX5200 (cheap 8xAGP, 128mb board which definately suits the Nvidea chipsets) I think in some peoples cases that the graphix card could quite easily make a difference.

D)I've quite heavily optimised our rig. (No networking, no other system resource hogs, just SCOPE). I listed the bios settings I've made in <a href="http://www.planetz.com/forums/viewtopic ... 9&16">this thread</a> Dunno if it'll help you or not, but I can tell you for sure 100% that our A7N8X-Deluxe can pull 14 Masterverbs without blinking (every time too, without the irratic behaviour you say you're getting)

As for Astros comment- "if you want some of the more demanding reverbs like MV-Pro or the STW 100 series than you MUST change the mobo"
... cough, splutter, on which Planet Astro? That statement is complete & utter rubbish, period. Loading 'Masterverb PROS', I can load 12 everytime. Loading the 13th gives the error "A capacity limit of your DSP cards has been reached" That ain't too freakin' bad for an oldish Nforce2 board :grin:
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valis
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Post by valis »

Perhaps try probing & changing the ATI's latency with Doubledawg. I have to do it on my laptop to get things stable, no matter what ATI driver (though I've noticed the the Omega drivers set it to a latency of 64 to 66, rather than 255 like stock ATI).
Shayne White
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Post by Shayne White »

Omega drivers? What's that?
bronYaur
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Post by bronYaur »

I have resolved some midi timing problem and vga bus occupation changin matrox g550 whit geforce 4 mx400 128 mb,the vga operation seem better when the daw working whit geforce my setup is:
p4 2.8
intel MB EMV2
three scope cards

I get 14 master verb whitout error
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astroman
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Post by astroman »

On 2006-04-18 02:33, Shroomz wrote:
...
As for Astros comment- "if you want some of the more demanding reverbs like MV-Pro or the STW 100 series than you MUST change the mobo"
... cough, splutter, on which Planet Astro? ...
planet reality :razz:

if an untweaked nforce2 delivers 8 MVs and you manage to queeze 14 out of yours (highly optimized), but an nforce3 is reported for 18 (as the even older T(C)USL...) and newer Intel chipsets (seem to) go even higher
then it makes no sense to stick with the inferior parts for the sake of (literally) 20 bucks spared - in particular because the reverbs mentioned (A100 in the first place) are of a completely different calibre regarding PCI load.
check the demos and report back your results... :wink:

cheers, Tom
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Shroomz~>
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Post by Shroomz~> »

On what sort of 'planet reality' do you get a worthwhile mobo, processor & memory upgrade for 'literally 20 bucks'? No way astro, you're not thinking straight at all. In the case of an NF2 to NF3 upgrade, it wouldn't be worthwhile to stick your old 333mHZ processor & memory in there as an NF3 mobo is capable of running everything syncronously at 400. Also, I've not seen very many NF3 MV results yeilding better performance than this optimised NF2 rig here. So, your point makes no sense in reality just because there's the odd rig running 18 or more MV's, which of course has sod all to do with the price of butter (or the price of a worthwhile upgrade for that matter) :razz:
:wink:
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astroman
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Post by astroman »

On 2006-04-19 08:07, Shroomz wrote:
...No way astro, you're not thinking straight at all. ...
yeah, that's a known problem of mine... :sad:
I even get paid for that disability :oops:
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Shroomz~>
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Post by Shroomz~> »

No matter what you get paid for Astro, I really don't think Z is the place to mislead people into unnecessarily upgrading their system to obtain a certain task. (as PC retailers do all the time) Telling anyone with an Asus A7N8X NF2 board that they 'MUST' upgrade it to be able to run MV pro & P100 (for example) is misinformation, period. Like I said, we can load 12 MV Pros without error on the mobo in question (yes, that's 1 per DSP in our case), which kinda sheds some serious doubt on your loosely given advice to upgrade the mobo IMO :razz:
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astroman
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Post by astroman »

I'd always suggest a top PCI chipset (like the mobo in Herr Voigt's system, for 180 Euro), if someone considers serious application of the STW verbs in several instances etc.
People have complained they bought those great reverbs and now they can only open one instance, blrb, blrb...

The advice to change the mobo was clearly related to that (single) condition - I even seconded the use of the existing system above.

don't you think Steffensen can decide for himself based on incoming suggestions such as this. ? :grin:

no need to challenge me, Shroomz - I will not get into pointless discussion with you - and for the sake of challenge you just lack the substance that could make it entertaining.

but thanks for confirming my impression (about you), Tom

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: astroman on 2006-04-19 12:16 ]</font>
hubird

Post by hubird »

On 2006-04-19 10:59, Shroomz wrote:
No matter what you get paid for Astro, I really don't think Z is the place to mislead people into unnecessarily upgrading their system...
halleluja... :roll:
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Shroomz~>
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Post by Shroomz~> »

Christ, here we go. :roll:

I wasn't attacking you Astr. If that's why you keep coming back more & more determined to prove that you weren't wrong when you actually (and clearly) just made a simple mistake & could've owned up to the fact that you were talking crap for once)

Fortunately for everyone else on the forum I'm not trying to entertain (or argue with) you & couldn't give a rats arse whether you're entertained or not. From my point of view there's nothing to be entertained about unless you cunningly baited me into the thread by telling Steffanson he 'MUST' upgrade his mobo for serious work (which was BS) If you did bait me then more fool you as knowone wants to see these argumentative situations. Do you never have the balls to say 'oops, yep, it seems I was completely wrong there'? It certainly doesn't look like it. :razz:

Oh & Hi Hubird :grin:
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astroman
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Post by astroman »

On 2006-04-20 01:55, Shroomz wrote:
... unless you cunningly baited me into the thread by telling Steffanson he 'MUST' upgrade his mobo for serious work (which was BS) ...
sorry, I really didn't want to answer, but that's irresistable...

does the sentence above suggest that I answer an arbitrary question with bad intentions so YOU can come to save the day ????
LMAO
you don't have to go that far...

7 posts above I answered your(!) question
5 posts above I already finished this with a joke.

I don't feel 'attacked' or 'offended' in any way, let alone I have to justify myself or anything before you...

I'm convinced that the best reverb deserves the best mobo, if it doesn't cost an arm and a leg, that's all.
Someone may share this opinion or not, but for sure it's not a 'mistake'.

The 'update suggestion' is your very own invention - as is this strange way of making a personal affair from all and everything

cheers, Tom
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Shroomz~>
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Post by Shroomz~> »

Hi again Steffensen,

I've got some more (hopefully relevant) info for you. :wink:

Our A7N8X running 12 DSPs loads 4 instances of the STW Classic Plate P100 no problem. With 4 loaded it's sitting at 80 to 84% overall DSP usage. Loading a 5th is too much for the 12 DSPs.

So, a summary of reverb tests on our A7N8X running 12 DSPs would reveal these results as achievable without errors >>

4 x STW Classic Plate P100 = approx' 84% DSP usage
12 x CWA Masterverb PRO = approx' 96% DSP usage
14 x CWA Masterverb = approx' 88% DSP usage

Not bad at all IMO.

Alternativey to tweaking you're A7N8X system to get improved results, you could buy a new 180euro mobo, a 180 euro CPU for it & 180 euros worth of matched Ram to put in it. That lot will set you back over 500 euro & you won't see any massive improvements in the Scope department (main improvements would be in VST plug-in land). You would need to decide if being able to run just a FEW xtra Scope reverbs is worth the blow to your pocket. If you can achieve the results we're getting on our A7N8X you might not feel the need to upgrade at all.
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Shroomz~>
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Post by Shroomz~> »

Astro, give me piece for fuc* sake.

If you can't admit giving misinformation, who cares.
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Gordon Gekko
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Post by Gordon Gekko »

<IMG SRC="http://perso.wanadoo.fr/laurent.molini/ifthen.JPG" BORDER="0">

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: legros on 2006-04-20 04:58 ]</font>
hubird

Post by hubird »

thought you was supposed to give up this paranoia competition behaviour, Shrooms...? :roll:
you're making a fool of yourself again...

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: hubird on 2006-04-20 05:08 ]</font>
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