BCF2000 and Pulsar Software

cjw1378 · Post by **cjw1378** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 12:29 pm

Hi there,

Does Creamware's latest software support MIDI parameter feedback?

I ask as someone who's yet to built his replacement DAW but who did get the BCF2000 out of the box just so I could see the faders move on their own - childish I know!

Now I'm wondering if I can get Pulsar's mixers, in particular, to send midi parameter feedback messages to the BCF2000 so that it'll put its faders into the right positon?

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 1:43 pm

It should be ok to connect the midi ou of the device to the midi in of the BCF 2000 (midi out DEST to Controller midi IN).

I'm very much interested in your results !

Mehdi

cjw1378 · Post by **cjw1378** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 2:45 pm

I tried this by connecting the output of a Phatboy to the input of the BCF2000, but had no dice in getting the fadrers on the BCF2000 to move as a result of twiddling the knob on the Phatboy.

My understanding is that MIDI parameter feedback is somethign differnet to the actual midi control message itself.

IS that the case?

wolf · Post by **wolf** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 2:55 pm

Just take care, that the midi channel in the scope mixer is set to the same as the receiving port of your control surface, then it should work.

kind regards
Wolfgang

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 4:05 pm

and in addition, the device must have a CC assigned to the fader/knob you are moving right ?

It is possible to record fader/knobs movements from scope to a sequencer for example, so if you use the right midi channel and the right CC numbers, I think it should work (I do not have the BCF though, bt i suppose it does not have anything special in this respect).

Does it work now ?

wolf · Post by **wolf** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 4:08 pm

and in addition, the device must have a CC assigned to the fader/knob you are moving right ?

errh, yes .. of course, I took this somehow for granted, so I forgot to mention it

cjw1378 · Post by **cjw1378** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 4:16 pm

Yes, I know how it's supposed to work, but can anyone tell me how MIDI parameter feedback actually works?

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 4:56 pm

well basically you must avoid creating a "midi feedback loop" (what goes out must no go back in).
This is usually done by using different midi In/Out on your controller. For ex, use usb for sending controllers, and the midi In to receive them from scope. This is doable IF the internal structure allows this.
It can be done by using a secondary driver of the usb (for ex, on my pcr, i just noticed that the second usb driver is independant from the first one. So on the same USB cable, i can use the pcr to play and send controllers to cubase scope, and the second one to update the memory of the pcr if needed.
So look at the Midi circuit/routing of your controller and see if, for example, you can forbid the info coming on Midi In to be sent to usb (physical midi, not usb) .
It is probably the case.
Good luck.

wolf · Post by **wolf** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 4:57 pm

This depends on the implementation and the application.
Generally it should work in the way, that the control receiving knob should send out the incoming controller value instead of sending the received value *through* the knob/device.
mmh .. hope this is understandable

marcuspocus · Post by **marcuspocus** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 7:00 pm

control feedback from all scope devices (that support midi or are inserted in a midi capable device) work perfectly. I use this at home with fw1884, and motorized faders. I can even recall setup to the control surface using scope preset on STM1632 for example.

If it doesn't work on bcf2000 (i guess it should), it's a bcf200 problem.

I can guarantee this

Beside, scope implemented this in a way that you can use the same port for in and out without creating a midi feedback loop.

What is received from the input is not transmitted back to output, but if a knob or fader is tweaked using the gui, the parameters are sended out, thus updating external midi value.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: marcuspocus on 2005-03-28 19:03 ]</font>

at0m · Post by **at0m** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 7:08 pm

Exactly. Only locally generated CC# are transmitter from SFP's device outputs. If you want to move the BCF with the fatboy, connect MIDI Source with MIDI Dest :>

cjw1378 · Post by **cjw1378** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:56 am

OK, got it now, The BCF2000 ships in a mode where it only listens on its USB port. After switching it to one where it listened on its MIDI input too, all was as I expected.

marcuspocus: why are you so certain the BCF2000 won't work with the Scope boards in the same way your fw1884 dpes?

marcuspocus · Post by **marcuspocus** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:32 am

I meant the contrary

I'm pretty sure the bcf will work the same way.