PlanetZ forums - scopeusers.com

Arcadios, I don't wanna confuse you even further, but...
I have a completely different setup (Win98, Pentium3, Pulsar One, SFP 3.1) than you, which 'normally' does what is supposed to regarding midi, yet it definetely(!) freaks out from time to time and produces nothing but stuck notes.
regardless what's connected and how much poly (mostly it's monophonic anyway).

I guess there's a certain combination of midi events that kust kills the system on a very low level, but I have no idea which one this might be.

cheers, Tom

thanks.
i suppose that it is impossible to avoid having stucked notes once in a while?

_________________
ELVIS LIVES

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-02-24 23:46 ]</font>

On 2006-02-24 11:11, ARCADIOS wrote:
are you refering to just reload six-xtring? or replace the six-string device in scopes devices folder?

Reload (after removing) the device in the project. Same with the midi filter.

/dave

I use cubase vst and cubase sx only for manage midi...all my proget no have audio track ,i load them in to sts 5000 ,i don,'t have stuking note problem,i have tweak my xp professional to the max,remember set processor usage to background service,and use midi port no emulated of scope,i have disble also vistual memory,upgradin my video cardo to geforce 128 mb prblem of midi jump are resolved moving and drop windows when my music is run,verificate is it the firs card is masterd card in your system in cset.ini
sorry for my bad english



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: bronYaur on 2006-02-26 03:06 ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: bronYaur on 2006-02-26 03:08 ]</font>

thanks, but i already have done these tweaks long time ago with other motherboard as well.
my midi stucking issue was the same regardless of xp optimization.
about page file, i do not see the reason why to disable it, just make it the same in min and max value, (1,5 times your ram) in order to avoid fragmentation of page file.
also i would like to tell you that i see less problems by using standard pc.
actually i do not use midi filters any more and i send first to sequencer and then sequencer sends to scope synths.
the only thing that makes me confused is why some scope synths like six-string for example tend to stuck more?
and why this happens especially when i raise polyphony(polyphony set to 1 does not cause stucks).
i think i should try another midi keyboard, and a very good midi cable as well.
i hope that this will fix this problem completelly.

_________________
ELVIS LIVES

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-02-26 14:55 ]</font>

didn't you mention the 'sequencer destination module' as a source of the problem recently ?
You seem to have a point on that.
I've reactivated my old TX7 module and kept loading banks and try out patches by a librarian program - got hanging notes constantly

setup:
midi source to sequencer destination and vice versa, the usual way
the midi input of the external synth was fed by a physical merger device, merging the program/control data with keyboard input

what happens seems like a 'reflection' of midi notes back into the software, by the external synth forwarding (a part of) it's input to it's midi out which is connected to the librarian software (so it can read the devices banks etc).
A (scope) midi filter module set to filter note events (both on and off) between midi-in/sequencer destination cured the hanging notes completely.

Afaik the CWA synths also forward their midi input to output (not sure if note events are included), so here is a condition where an error can occur (a hanging note isn't much more than a lost event)

I would connect a midi filter set to note-on, note-off to the SixStrings's midi out and connect that to whatever midi destination (so it has a defined state)

good luck, Tom

Will try that midi filter trick, I have the same problem, usually on Minimax.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: geoffd99 on 2006-03-14 15:31 ]</font>

forget it.
i am desperate.
stuckkkkkcck.. ckkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkksssssss

i see it from midi monitor.
the midi misses a "midi off" singal and then the note stays to "midi on"
it might be my clavinova that does not send midi data ok, or the midi cable.
i don't know




is anybody here that has not AT ALL stucks?
with what midi keyboard? what cable? what pc? how much money for no stucking midi data, what do i have to do, what is going on, why this happens to me, what am i?????

it breaks my nerves really
i have got a midi ..ucking note issue
_________________
ELVIS LIVES

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-03-14 17:17 ]</font>

once in a very great while....once a year or at worst several months, i might see a stuck midi note.

I don't know any details about Clavinovas, but if it has an external power supply this could be the culprit.
Those (wallwart) boxes don't last forever.
Usually the sound processing is much less sensible to 'underpower' than the midi port.
Which means the internal sounds are perfectly ok, but data transmission is incomplete, most likely due to (specs of) the opto-coupler on the keyboards midi interface.

cheers, tom

Hi ARCADIOS
I don't think it is a hardware problem, the note 'off' being missed by the synth, is by definition, a stuck note.

But I think it is the Scope synth that has the problem, not the input values, since midi data is very slow compared to my computer (3 GHz - I mean!). It is also not really midi data - in that it is not going down a physical cable.

My stuck notes are coming from internal sequencing, very slow notes, not fast at all. It's just some Scope thing. I don't see how the sequencer out virtual lead in Scope, can lose a note off note.
I get it mostly on the Minimax, but also some others, including some third party synths - and these use Scope 'atoms' (is that what they are called?).
GaryB, it may be rare on your system, but this doesn't mean it is not a Scope problem, it means the conditions for it happening, only arise on other (completely tweaked) PC systems. Short of getting you to supply us with new PCs, what is the solution?

Unless it is to do with sequencers, but I get it with Live, Sonar, not Nuendo and Cubase.

PS - Actually if Creamware had supplied fitted out PCs, I bet a lot of us would buy from them.

Ayway, I will report back later about the midi filter as I am at work now!
Gx

garyb, you are lucky. what system do you use?
astroman,i have a good ups, and the clavinova is not taking power from it. i will feed it good 220v but i don't think that this will fix anything.
i tell you this:

when i play the keyboard without any synth connected and just connect scope midi source to seq midi dest, the midi data go just fine.
i record in a midi channel in nuendo and there are not any stucked notes. this can be seen eather from midi monitor or by the lines drawed in nuendos midi recording channel, so no line will stay stucked continiusly as a line.
when i load a scope synth and connect it there are NO problems when polyphony is set to 1. but when i raise polyphony from 2 and up, then the stucks will appear, shown also as missed "note off" in midi monitor, or stucked continius lines in recording midi channel of nuendo.
of cource you can hear it as well.

the same happens without nuendo, just with scope platform playing synths.
polyphony 1 is ok, polyphony 2 and up will cause stucks.

m...y n... e... r... v.. e.. zz

sorry, smilies cannot discribe my feelings

Hi
I have just used the midi filter on my Minimax, from Seq source, from Live 5; doesn't make any difference to problem.
With note on and note off allowed, nothing else, and only that midi channel for the Minimax, it still drops notes. I am pretty sure that Live 5 is working OK! Anyway, other synths are fine.
When I block 'note on' in the midi filter, ie just 'offs' allowed through, it stops the stuck note.

So it must be 'inside' Minimax.

Incidentally, I have just started using B2003, that does it as well - so does anyone have a fix? Within a few bars, there is a stuck note. It isn't even easy to sequence it - since there is a huge organ note droning away!

Don't ask me how to fix it. My midi is entirely internal.

AFter this stuck note on the B2003, I unloaded it and loaded some other synths - but they wouldn't connect midi leads (ie clicking was not connecting the lines) OR the audio outputs. So I have to reload the whole project.
This sounds like a general problem, not just stuck notes. I am in 4.0 but I understand v4.5 is the same. And why has this suddenly got worse?

On reload ig get the message:

EXCEPTION
nil reference on left side of '.' as a result of expression "group"

whatever that means!

I just recorded the Minimax loop. But if I was trying to actually play it, I might be a bit miffed. Is this the point of the OSB boxes? So we buy the hardware version of our soft synths? Just a thought.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: geoffd99 on 2006-03-15 13:40 ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: geoffd99 on 2006-03-15 13:45 ]</font>

i don't want to dissapoint but i think that if you try other scope synths you will see the same problem.
try six-string or whatever with raised polyphony and play for a few minutes.


i want to tell this to CREAMWARE

it is very frustrating to see that i can play "propellerheads reason" with 10 and over synths loaded together without any stucking notes.
or VST plugins that seem to be fine..........
and when i play $cope$ $ynth$ to be so ................ i don't want to say

i will change my pc tomorow if you tell me what is the best.
the same about midi cable and midi controller.
help


System Information report written at: 03/15/06 23:41:10
System Name: ARC
[IRQs]

Resource Device Status
IRQ 5 RADEON X800 PRO/GTO OK
IRQ 3 Intel(R) 82801EB USB2 Enhanced Host Controller - 24DD OK
IRQ 9 Silicon Image SiI 3112 SATARaid Controller OK
IRQ 11 Creamware Scope OK
IRQ 11 Creamware Pulsar2 OK
IRQ 14 Primary IDE Channel OK
IRQ 15 Secondary IDE Channel OK
IRQ 10 Intel(R) 82801ER SATA RAID Controller OK
IRQ 7 Intel(R) 82801EB SMBus Controller - 24D3 OK
IRQ 0 System timer OK
IRQ 1 PC/AT Enhanced PS/2 Keyboard (101/102-Key) OK
IRQ 4 Communications Port (COM1) OK
IRQ 6 Standard floppy disk controller OK
IRQ 8 System CMOS/real time clock OK
IRQ 13 Numeric data processor OK
IRQ 12 Microsoft PS/2 Port Mouse (IntelliPoint) OK
System Information report written at: 03/15/06 23:45:05
System Name: ARC
[I/O]

Resource Device Status
0x00000022-0x0000003F PCI bus OK
0x00000044-0x00000047 PCI bus OK
0x0000004C-0x0000006F PCI bus OK
0x00000072-0x0000007F PCI bus OK
0x00000090-0x00000091 PCI bus OK
0x00000093-0x0000009F PCI bus OK
0x000000A2-0x000000BF PCI bus OK
0x000000E0-0x000000EF PCI bus OK
0x00000100-0x00000CF7 PCI bus OK
0x00000D00-0x0000FFFF PCI bus OK
0x0000A000-0x0000AFFF Intel(R) 82875P Processor to AGP Controller - 2579 OK
0x0000A000-0x0000AFFF RADEON X800 PRO/GTO OK
0x000003B0-0x000003BB Intel(R) 82875P Processor to AGP Controller - 2579 OK
0x000003B0-0x000003BB RADEON X800 PRO/GTO OK
0x000003C0-0x000003DF Intel(R) 82875P Processor to AGP Controller - 2579 OK
0x000003C0-0x000003DF RADEON X800 PRO/GTO OK
0x00008000-0x00008007 Silicon Image SiI 3112 SATARaid Controller OK
0x00008400-0x00008403 Silicon Image SiI 3112 SATARaid Controller OK
0x00008800-0x00008807 Silicon Image SiI 3112 SATARaid Controller OK
0x00008C00-0x00008C03 Silicon Image SiI 3112 SATARaid Controller OK
0x00009000-0x0000900F Silicon Image SiI 3112 SATARaid Controller OK
0x00000A79-0x00000A79 ISAPNP Read Data Port OK
0x00000279-0x00000279 ISAPNP Read Data Port OK
0x00000274-0x00000277 ISAPNP Read Data Port OK
0x0000F000-0x0000F00F Intel(R) 82801EB Ultra ATA Storage Controllers OK
0x000001F0-0x000001F7 Primary IDE Channel OK
0x000003F6-0x000003F6 Primary IDE Channel OK
0x00000170-0x00000177 Secondary IDE Channel OK
0x00000376-0x00000376 Secondary IDE Channel OK
0x0000C000-0x0000C007 Intel(R) 82801ER SATA RAID Controller OK
0x0000C400-0x0000C403 Intel(R) 82801ER SATA RAID Controller OK
0x0000C800-0x0000C807 Intel(R) 82801ER SATA RAID Controller OK
0x0000CC00-0x0000CC03 Intel(R) 82801ER SATA RAID Controller OK
0x0000D000-0x0000D00F Intel(R) 82801ER SATA RAID Controller OK
0x00000500-0x0000051F Intel(R) 82801EB SMBus Controller - 24D3 OK
0x00000020-0x00000021 Programmable interrupt controller OK
0x000000A0-0x000000A1 Programmable interrupt controller OK
0x00000040-0x00000043 System timer OK
0x00000000-0x0000000F Direct memory access controller OK
0x00000081-0x00000083 Direct memory access controller OK
0x00000087-0x00000087 Direct memory access controller OK
0x00000089-0x0000008B Direct memory access controller OK
0x0000008F-0x00000091 Direct memory access controller OK
0x000000C0-0x000000DF Direct memory access controller OK
0x00000060-0x00000060 PC/AT Enhanced PS/2 Keyboard (101/102-Key) OK
0x00000064-0x00000064 PC/AT Enhanced PS/2 Keyboard (101/102-Key) OK
0x000003F8-0x000003FF Communications Port (COM1) OK
0x000003F0-0x000003F5 Standard floppy disk controller OK
0x000003F7-0x000003F7 Standard floppy disk controller OK
0x00000061-0x00000061 System speaker OK
0x00000070-0x00000071 System CMOS/real time clock OK
0x000000F0-0x000000FF Numeric data processor OK


_________________
ELVIS LIVES

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-03-15 13:47 ]</font>

Hi
My PC is generally fine, and is now working OK, but not with B2003 or Minmax, but other synths seem ok including Six String.

I have gone down the change PC route, I spend man-years (it seems) fiddling about with it.
I have inve$ted as you have, po$$ibly more, and I understand why they don't get CW card reviews or mentions in the UK anymore. How can the system be recommended to new people, apart from as an enthusiasts club, like a nice old classy car? You have to either join the PlanetZ club, or buy ProTools etc.

(Now I expect some Gurus to have a go at me, as obviously I don't understand PCs, or appreciate that a 'proper' DAW involves more ... etc etc )

Problem is resale is very low. So you hang on and use work-arounds. It is wonderful how other cheap software now does a million things at once, and doesn't seem to notice it.
But we have Creamware, which is a lot of fun to fiddle about with (I am not joking!)

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: geoffd99 on 2006-03-15 14:06 ]</font>

i am playning with six string and polyphony 1 about 30 minutes, and no stucks.
now i will raise polyphony to 2.

wait...

ups.... stuckkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

which pc controller might be most importand for midi stuff?
chipset maybe?

i started looking for most new drivers and i don't know if this will help

i wish i had some better things to write than this: i can name at least 10 computers that work fine with no stuck notes 99% of the time. midi patch bays often have a "panic" button for stuck notes because complicated midi setups are a little bit prone to stuck notes anyway. well, maybe this post will be more encouraging than annoying....

did you try relacing the wall wart as astroman suggested, if there is one?

I've the solution for this problem if you work with Logic Audio. It has to do with the settings in logic synhronization preferences. Turn off the option "send midi clock" to a pulsar midi channel/port. this triggers stuck notes. I could never fix this problem whatever i did, chang irq, physical slots , another motherboard , tweaking windows , etc. i've tried all. I don't know any solutions for nuendo/cubase or other sequencers.

good luck,

michiel