Getting rid of Freezes

lysergide · Post by **lysergide** » Wed Oct 06, 2004 12:07 pm

Hello all.

I've posted some topics already about bsod's and winxp freezes.

i still suffer from freezes unfortunately, and my system is TOTALLY useless and unworkable.

I've tried several configurations, reformatted and reinstalled windows a few times already.

I wanted to know is how can you tell if you have faulty Hardware and the problem doesn't come from bad configurations or irq problems?

How can you tell if you have something wrong with your HD/RAM/GRAPHICS CARD/MOBO/WHATEVER?

I've had this computer for around 4 monthes, still no cure for my problems and i've gotten pretty desperate and also uninspirational as i've spent all this money and can't make any music with it.

Hope someone can help...

Lior

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Wed Oct 06, 2004 4:02 pm

Have you replaced your damaged mobo yet ? The overwhelming advice in your other thread was to replace it.

lysergide · Post by **lysergide** » Wed Oct 06, 2004 4:23 pm

not yet,
first because i'm pretty much broke right now don't have the cash to start replacing computer devices.

secondly, i'm not really sure this would solve all my problems...

i will give it a go but only next month when i get some $$ (unfortunately i'll have to wait till then)...

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Wed Oct 06, 2004 8:07 pm

I know what you mean. Must be hard too since you have obviously spent a bit setting everything up. But that appears to be the culprit. But time is money, so I'd suggest not frustrating yourself anymore until then. Spend the time on productive work elsewhere...

Post by **hubird** » Wed Oct 06, 2004 11:49 pm

I'm sorry to say this Lysegide, because you're in trouble now, and I don't do this often, but your crit de coeur makes me do it

You say
I wanted to know is how can you tell if you have faulty Hardware and the problem doesn't come from bad configurations or irq problems?
How can you tell if you have something wrong with your HD/RAM/GRAPHICS CARD/MOBO/WHATEVER?

I mean, it's one or the other.
If you choose for a pc, it's hard to be sure on forehand about the perfect hardware in combination with one of the many Windows versions.

On pc the best you can do is to buy a solid hi-end system like Xeon, for € 2800,- or more.
But then you still have an operating system that is not specificly made for multi media usage, and not is fine tuned to a specific hardware combination.
Not to mention the moderate compatibility between the different Windows versions.

At the end you have to deal with three parties, beeing the hardware, the operating system, and the application software.
It's almost logic that somewhere on the road you have to encounter problems, Most of us get things right, I definetely would not, if I was on pc

It's just that I hate to be unsure about my system, and I hate it to solve problems.
Specially I hate it not to know if a problem is soft- or hardware related.
That's why I work on mac.
Hard- and software come from the same one company, and this makes the difference.

Is there a hardware problem? fine, everyone has that problem, Apple will work on it

Is there a serious software problem? Ok., likely everyone with that software will have that problem, and the creators of that software will work on it

Sure, there's always a chance you get a serious hardware problem, but a mac is a good brand

So, I understand your angryness, but you choose for a compromise between quality (be it mac or pc) and price.
Plus you count on your own abilities to solve problems (well, and planetz friends, who are very helpfull I must say

), which is part of the price.

There are still two big problems to solve for Creamware concerning mac, there is the PCI voltage change of the new macs, and second there isn't an OS-X version of the Scope platform, though it's coming hopefully.
If these two problems wouldn't exist, I would more often point out that there is an good alternative for Windows.
I have the feeling I can't do that now, because the upgrading situation from 'Classic' to OSX is unsure.
Still some friends of us are trying for months already to get the machine working.
That's horror, to my feeling.

I never wanne find myself in that situation. If I have to pay for quality I'll do that, and if a quality pc system is as expensive as a comparable mac I buy a mac because the soft- and hardware is de facto 100% compatible.

I'd say, if anyone might be desperate: sell your computer, buy a 2nd hand mac G4/(fill in from 440-2*1gig) and work with OS9.2.2 as long as it takes.
Explore, Outlook, Office 2001, MSN, WMP, RP etc., they all work fine on mac

At least you'll have some songs created after some months

[ This Message was edited by: hubird on 2004-10-07 00:54 ]

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:02 am

Instead of just replacing his broken mobo he should sell his whole system ?

Next person might suggest moving house

lysergide · Post by **lysergide** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 3:35 am

hubird - i know you work for THEM!!! preaching about MAC systems... you're one of them aren't you???? trying to get people to sell their beloved pc's.... you won't get away with it you hear??

and now seriously..

last night i reset my BIOS definitions, since then everything runs fine (for some reason which is beyond me) i've been testing it out abit, don't wanna get TOO excited (yet!)

so everything SEEMS to work without freezing, only time will tell if this time it's for good..

and about the mobo - next month i will be replacing it anyway for an INTEL D865PERL..

will see how that goes..

Lior

Post by **hubird** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 8:03 am

oh yes I work for THEM

I hope you solved the problem now, and can go back to making music

I also have some troubles sometimes on my mac, like last week, but they can be solved more easily because I don't have to doubt about the hard- and software combination.
Oh man, I would be lost working on pc, all the variabels that one has to encounter, it can end up with 'Is it the Acpi layer, or is the fan supply too weak?' ... ahrr

Glad you got it right (sofar), sorry for my useless advising

maybe it was usefull for someone else to think twice before buying anything.
I hope you get Mega Perls in your new INTEL D865PERL

cheerz

krizrox · Post by **krizrox** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 1:03 pm

Could it be heat related? I seem to remember, a long time ago, there were numerous threads about heat related issues. If your system doesn't have sufficient ventilation, this could happen (especially with all those DSP's cooking away inside).

Just trying to help

Post by **hubird** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 7:18 pm

On 2004-10-07 14:03, krizrox wrote:
Could it be heat related?

Thanks Krizrox, that underlines greatly what I was talking about

I even deleted a sentence before posting that was saying something like 'It's horror to me not knowing if the problem is hard- or software related, it could even be a underpowering fan's supply'...
I thought I don't wanne sound sinical so I deleted it.
Great timing Krizrox, hehe

edit: oops, I see I put that fan supply statement in my second post already...memory is taning I guess

[ This Message was edited by: hubird on 2004-10-08 14:04 ]

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 7:40 pm

Now now Hubird don't gloat

Post by **hubird** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 7:59 pm

the gloating of a minority member

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 9:12 pm

now since the problem is solved - congrats

btw, let me add a little to the minority report...

I fully agree with Hubird's strategy, but it just feels uncomfortable to suggest a 3 year old 2nd hand system.
Nevertheless it would often be the most simple and satisfying solution - to whom it may concern...

Myself I run 2 Pulsars in a 1 gig Celeron on Intel 815 under Win98 with few problems, but once you install/uninstall various software over a period of time, even that simple thing runs mad.
And I can confirm I've spent 10 times as much with system re-installs on that box (and the ones in the office running W2K) than with any Mac (since 1985).

So anyone considering his or her time at least something valuable (it really IS) should be very concerned about the Win-way.

Unless the system is setup with a limited number of well known apps and NEVER changed again. This doesn't prevent Windows from it's usual amnesia when it forgets about system configuration for obscure reasons, but at least the chance for trouble is lower

Since Apple is selling notebooks for 1K euro they can't be called expensive anymore and the latest G5s have a design that even made me (an OSX hater) want one

The press pictures don't even represent half of the aesthetics of that case

Apple is just one quality brand among others, but definetely the one with the most impressive design - a little extra $$ for pleasing the eyes is justyfied imho, considering what PC modders shell for tasteless nonsense

cheers, Tom

Post by **hubird** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 10:11 pm

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 11:45 pm

I think I walked into the wrong nightclub. Damn, yes I did, I'm meant to be next door.

Bloody stupid name anyway "iClub". I'll just put down my "iDrink", push back my translucent round-edged "iChair" and "iExit".

Post by **garyb** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 1:31 am

it's all hammers and ball bearings to me.....

samplaire · Post by **samplaire** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 4:57 am

Macs Make Music

Post by **hubird** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 8:11 am

On 2004-10-06 13:07, lysergide wrote:
...my system is TOTALLY useless and unworkable.

that's what I'm talking about, and poor Lysergide is not alone, check the everyday soap in the problem forum

For some less mony you get a lot more (chance of) troubles with the open pc approach.
If one then actually has serious troubles, and desparately shouts out 'How do I know if it's a hard- or a software problem', then it's ME who's amazed, see above

I can easily handle some kidding about mac, that's how it goes with the best and most beautifull girl in scool class

Still, what exactly is it that men think a mac is for softies or gays?

Is the idea of configuring your own pc a sexy thing?
Does the chance that things go wrong along the config process appeal to basic gambling instincts of the pioniering men?
Are youth sentiments involved, always wanting to play and build things with that good old mecano box?
Is it tough to mock the outlooks and built-in extras of the mac, and if so, why don't men never spread this attitude if they are talking about top cars, their tools, and women?

I totally don't feel being member of something like a mac family, and if I would find a better system, I would change to that better system as soon as possible.
In fact, contrary to Astro

, I think OSX IS that better system, and hey it's mac again,

To some degree I could feel the sex appeal of the DIY pc, IF the thing would stay stable over time, with different system versions and all.
That's obviously not the case.
So what's sexy about a wife that's leaving the house every year and needs to get brought back in the house?
I'd feel ashamed for the neighbours instead of feeling proud to have her back...

At the end I'm not interested in my computer, not at all.
Actually I'm not even talking about mac, I'm talking about beeing sure I can make music, today, tomorrow, and next year, without having too much troubles.
That is sexy

cheers mates

[ This Message was edited by: hubird on 2004-10-08 14:08 ]

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 11:24 am

On 2004-10-08 09:11, hubird wrote:
... In fact, contrary to Astro , I think OSX IS that better system, and hey it's mac again,
...

makes sense and is perfectly understandable

you make music on the Mac in the first place and one has to consider that Apple put some great fundamentals for digital audio in their original OS. That 4, 8 and 16 bit stuff was pretty groundbreaking in mid 80s and built in EVERY Mac, right out of the box.

But that's about it - when things developed further a small company later known as Digidesign made some smart moves and managed to take over the pro market almost completely.
Not at all unwelcomed by Apple who suddenly found their system in all major studios.

So they left the further developement to Digidesign as a 3rd party and since the market segment was conquered already no additional moves were necessary - a very comfortable situation.
Not to mention that in those years CPUs were completely outperformed by DSPs.
BIG Protools systems did run on machines clocked at 32 MHZ those years...

As usual things don't stop and one day Apple had to realize their complete lack of knowledge to satisfy upcoming consumer needs, who wanted all that stuff without additional investments in 'studio' gear.

OSX is in fact the better music and media system and Apple puts a lot of effort in it, coupling additional services it and even new gear like the iPod.

That's one side of the coin, but Apple's main segment (and cash cow) is the publishing industry, which is where I earn most of my income

Small office systems aren't as widespread as Wintel installations, but not completely neglectable.
And in these domains Apple's classic OS simply rules - OSX is as superfluous as a truck to go for weekend shopping (though this may vary with the size and demands of your family...).

My dislike of OSX is only related to these applications and the overall network and system structure in this domain.
I HAVE seen (productive !) machines running unserviced for years and you can be assured that one of Europe's biggest supplier for print services (located in my area) processes at least 50% of the jobs still originating from OS9 systems

To make a long story short: noone knows how the classic Mac OS would have evolved if apple had put the same amount of developement in it's media parts as they put into OSX the last 6 (!) years.

The only thing for shure is that they would have sold a huge amount of hardware less

cheers, Tom

Post by **garyb** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 12:49 pm

macs are great, but i have never had a pc not work since i started using good parts(like apple does). good parts, properly installed should work as flawlessly as a computer can.

*edit* osx is a boondoggle no matter how well it works. astroman, i do think you have hit the nail on the head. apple needs to sell hardware to stay in business....

[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2004-10-08 13:51 ]