ethics of warez ad nauseum (was: "to John Cooper")

peripatitis · Post by **peripatitis** » Thu Sep 27, 2001 3:01 pm

This is a very dissapointing reaction and i am refering to the lock of a certain topic.
I am not going to support kwild because first of all i don't think he deserves it
(he certainly crossed the line , not with what he said but how he said it)however beeing raised with anchestors like socrates aristoteles ,periklis, e.t.c. i feel offended by this method.If we feel that what kwild said was abusive offensive or whatever
we could simply ignore him or try to persuade him with a gentle manner. sencorsip
with "politicaly correct clothing " continues to be the enemy of freedom of speach.I am very dissapointed and personally offended , i don't care even if kwild was swearing my mother or if he was a nazi a terrorist a serial killer or whatever ,let him say what he thinks.I find no justification or maturity in this desision , and i hope that it was made in the heat of the moment.By the way you won't protect this forum members from piracy or whatever neither the serious and informative nature of it like that .Unlock it and let it sink in time's eternal sea.

subhuman · Post by **subhuman** » Thu Sep 27, 2001 3:41 pm

I again choose to strongly disagree with you.

jupiter8 · Post by **jupiter8** » Thu Sep 27, 2001 4:18 pm

I think he can say what he wants if he chooses to say it elsewhere.

subhuman · Post by **subhuman** » Thu Sep 27, 2001 4:20 pm

Exactly

samplaire · Post by **samplaire** » Thu Sep 27, 2001 6:25 pm

I've been working as a dj at a radio station for about 10 years. The first rule if somebody (a listener) used junk vocabulary online was to close the phone hybrid fader then not to comment his speech. Why? Because in 90% he/she wanted to have his/her 5 minutes, to be seen/heard by masses. In my opinion John Cooper should delete the mentioned thread not to allow the guy showing to his friends 'how brave he is'.

[ This Message was edited by: samplaire on 2001-09-27 19:27 ]

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Sep 27, 2001 7:20 pm

Yep. Let's not have hack/warez/piracy crap here. I'm glad it's locked and would prefer it deleted.

peripatitis · Post by **peripatitis** » Thu Sep 27, 2001 10:53 pm

Can you give the reasons for the locking of the topic?Do you feel that kwild might have convinced you to use cracked versions of the software?perhaps he had a seductive alure that could lead you in cheatery?Did you have to reply to him?what would happen if you wouldn't pay attention to his words?This is not the way to show your disagreement with someones opinion , and this behaviour doesn't stop which is the barrior that you set between what should be alowed to be expressed and what not?If you start censoring people for their opinions a day will come when you will be censored too , for the "common good".Such a behaviour from "people of art" as we are supposed to be seems very demeaning to me.We have the freedom of choice which is though aplying only to how we lead our lives and not how someone else is .Why did those people reply to kwild , was it because they wanted to teach him a lesson? perhaps they wanted to show him and their friends how "brave" they were?.You judged a man because a few sentences that he wrote and you were very quick to do so and when you felt that he got what he deserved you desided to shut the subject.If you read once again those posts besides seeing kwild crossing the line you can see that people that responded also did the same in a way that cannot be justified , we have to understand that apart from having the right opinion we have to learn how to stand by it.A man can be right or wrong and this is quite a subjective manner , however the way he defends his opinions proves his
good intension and he has to prove his good intension or else his opinion doesn't matter anymore.I dont agree with the use of cracked software , neither with copied cd's nor copied movies e.t.c. but the way people reacted on the subject sounded a bit hypocritical knowing from the people that surround me and from the society i live in that perhaps most of them have done some of the above crimes.If you felt so offended with what he admited you could simply ignore him , let him say what he wanted and report him to the police or the sofware companies e.t.c. since you felt that justice should be
payed.By the way i would like John's opinion Also on this ,since he was the one who locked the topic.

peripatitis · Post by **peripatitis** » Thu Sep 27, 2001 11:08 pm

Hey subhuman it seems to me that the day we'll on something should be marked as a
celebration in this site ritual.
just kiding.

captain kirkus · Post by **captain kirkus** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 12:16 am

Wow he attacked me greatly, and with style. I love his spelling and wording and style of typing. Cant belive it....Funny.
This is a serious forum or use to be.John
Bowen this must be the guy who use to pretend to be me and tout crakz. I dont use them or support them.
And makeing copies of cds you own is legal for your own use and napster lost and had to pay up ,and yes cracking is illegal.
If you were found with craks on your hard drive youd go to jail or be liable for a law suit..
I know hes not smart enough to crack programs by his typeing but he is a criminal after the fact and that is equal to being the cracker himself
Do as you must and people defend him if you must but in essence you are all like him too.
Your either for law or not and defending his statements shows your true colors.
have a good day all , and Kwild read some books and learn to type or again shut up

nicked · Post by **nicked** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 2:08 am

storms and teacups come to mind

kwild · Post by **kwild** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 5:29 am

Thanx a lot peripatitics.U are a real man.
I want to give my excuse to the all the people of this forum,but some guy started to offend me and i simply reply in that manner.
For kirkus...im not english,i have learned a bit of english using internet and hearing hip hop music im a workin class man not a student or a rich man or whatever.
Im from Italy ,i don't think u are able to speak any words in Italian,so...shut up.
I think some people here is a bit Fa$scist but i don't want to make other problems here.
I don't change my mind,but,repeat a give my excuse to all the people of that forum,whit a last word...look inside of the things...this "politically correct" pphilosophy is very hypocrit,it's not true.
It's too difficult to express what i really want to say,excuse my english.
See Ya.Best regards.

[ This Message was edited by: kwild on 2001-09-28 06:30 ]

algorhythm · Post by **algorhythm** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 5:43 am

peripatitis wrote:
If you start censoring people for their opinions a day will come when you will be censored too , for the "common good". Such a behaviour from "people of art" as we are supposed to be seems very demeaning to me.

This is a great example of the relativistic, subjective ethics of our time, and is quite a load of shit. John did not censor anyone for a subjective opinion, although kwild did have one.

If you start talking on this forum about what music you like, or what food you think tasted good, you would express your subjective opinion, and you might be chastized for geing OT, I seriously doubt that your thread will get closed. The situation is quite different with different issues. While someone may have their own opinion on theft, that does not mean that they are correct. Stealing is objectively wrong because you violate someone else's right to their property. This forum exists to help people with their Creamware hardware and related software. Without monetary support to these parties, THIS SITE WOULD NOT EXIST. Therefore, this site cannot allow for the encouragement of piracy, as it is contrary to its own existence. Not to mention that stealing is wrong.

And your bit about People of Art is fargin' stupid!

- people of art should respect opinions, because artistic opinions vary. But about matters of fact? That is absurd! It seems very demeaning to me that because someone is an artist that they can hold a view. The example of murder for instance: if someone holds that murder is OK, and they want to know whether or not there new murder plan (plan 3) will be foiled by the new law enforcement practices, and they want others help in evading the law, any artist, any person I say, ought not allow not to mention encourage this person!

People are entitled to hold the opinion that the earth is flat. Merely believing this does not make it so.

happy pulsarizing

_________________
[ { ( - algorhythm - ) } ] /

[ This Message was edited by: algorhythm on 2001-09-28 06:43 ]

lionel_talkover · Post by **lionel_talkover** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 8:15 am

The message from kwild was a little surrealist. The censure is a critical point and I don't think it's the best way to give a message anyway. Well, I am not judge for this. The only think I wanted to say is about cracks on pulsar/scope system. I earn money from music I make for videogames essentially. I'm in the business for 8 years. I had a classical studio with a D8b, S6000, Tc and lexicon effects, several synths... I met the pulsar two years ago. The system had some huge bugs, I change my motherboards several times to have the good one, creamware communication is really bad...etc...etc. But this product is a real bomb. WIth logic and my only 2 pulsar cards, I make almost the same work. I sold everything except one or two synths. I have all my sample libraries on hd , compare to my akai, my work is more efficient. Just to say that this plateform is a real chance for people to make serious music and mixes for a very reasonable price. To make the same things 3 years ago, it would have been impossible for so little money !! I understand Pulsar could be expensive for people but we must try to understand the issue. I bought some devices like the sonictimeworks last years. I had a PCM91, I made some test that I gave on the CW forum. The plug is reallly close to the PCM for 1/15 of the price. If we want people like serious developpers for pulsar, we have to buy the plugs. Mostly all the devices have a free demo. It's a good way to test. I don't want to see the system killed for this. Kwild ,please understand this. I recently used a crack version of nuendo cause there is no demo available. I'm not a saint. But now I have to buy it cause it corresponds to my needs. I think the developper have to make demos, espacially for huge sequencers, cause it's a strategic decision to buy such softs. Anyway, the synths on pulsar are not really expensives, I saw a subject about prices and to be honnest, it's ridiculous to talk about that. We don't need eveything, I don't understand this politics on having everything on your computer, just to say. Try the demos and you will see your needs. The amiga was killed by piracy, I made musics for illegals groups when I was youger, and we were upset about what we have done. I have no lessons to give, Pulsar could be a serious plateform, so we have to talk about that. And censure is not a dialog.

John Cooper · Post by **John Cooper** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 8:16 am

On 2001-09-27 16:01, peripatitis wrote:
sencorsip
with "politicaly correct clothing " continues to be the enemy of freedom of speach.I am very dissapointed and personally offended

while in an ideal world, i agree with your comments about freedom of speech, i have been hosting these forums a long time, and have witnessed all kinds of infantile behavior around the subject of warez (including attacks on this site, etc), and i will not tolerate any further promotion of warez in these forums. this forum is a directed and *loosely* moderated list, that is supposed to be in support of the user community of creamware products. it is most people's belief here that pirating the products we're trying to use will only hurt the companies and individuals who are feeding back into this community, thus hurting ourselves.

in short, you've all agreed to the <a href="http://planetz.ghostwheel.com/forums/bb ... ent">Forum Membership Agreement</a> which states clearly that the forum moderator has the right to remove objectionable topics. the only time i have ever removed any topic is either at the request of the topic poster, or if it was promoting software piracy. if you don't agree with this policy, you can leave any time.

many forum members have sent me email asking me to delete these warez-related posts. i agree, and so i shall delete them.

-john

John Cooper · Post by **John Cooper** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 8:26 am

On 2001-09-28 01:16, captain kirkus wrote:
John Bowen this must be the guy who use to pretend to be me and tout crakz.

excuse me? either you'e got the wrong name, or whoever was touting warez was using a fake name. john bowen has created some of the most interesting 3rd party products for pulsar, as well some of the coolest components of the pulsar system itself. clearly he is one of the individuals most directly personally/financially affected by all this warez talk.

-john

madmod · Post by **madmod** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 8:33 am

I did see any of the thread but
I think warez have killed alot of good plaforms.
And i for one support Johns stance on warez
I would like to see some other of the top third party's get some more plugs on this rocking system.
peace be with you

lionel_talkover · Post by **lionel_talkover** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 8:43 am

John, you had good reasons to kill the messages and be offend by this is an exagerate reaction ...but don't you think serious subjects about piracy can't be a way of making some people to understand ?

ronaldmeij · Post by **ronaldmeij** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 8:55 am

Come on guys

I pay shitloads of mony for real sample cd'roms and software for my pulsar system.

For shure i don't like guys who have cracked software because i pay for it everybody has to pay.

i cant believe it , that guys are talking on a forum with about 99 % official creamware clients about hacked software..

Or it is really dum , or the just don't respect the hard working man who pay's for his gear...

That's my vision about hacking and cracking

Ronald Meij.

Robert · Post by **Robert** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 12:01 pm

Unbelievable, just unbelievable!
You Warez/Crackz boys must live on another planet to expect a bloke who makes his living, or part of his living, on developing stuff for Pulsar to give space to people who want to rip him off. Well, the mind boggles.
What about the developers who post their previews of new stuff here? Do you think they'd do that if they knew, in another thread, there's someone telling people how to get it for free?
Try thinking sometimes.
Robert

peripatitis · Post by **peripatitis** » Fri Sep 28, 2001 3:26 pm

I totaly agree with Lionel on this matter.
John:Freedom of speach and generally all the values that have based our similar civilisations cannot be bent because of the
non ideal society.If you do so you have to accept the dangers that will rise from such an prespective , just consider that since a big percentage of computer users have cracked versions of various software you would then have to accept that software piracy isn't illegal just because our world isn't ideal, and this is something that you and i don't want to happen .
I still don't see what was achieved by locking or deleting the topic.When matters arise you have to confront them , not avoid them.
To algorithm:first of all have in mind that
a load of shit(as you very politely commended on my opinion) has the distinctive characteristic of smelling like one ,so you could very easily avoid responding to me since everyone could "smell" my opinions.Secondly there not such thing as
an objective opinion and please understand that truth is not a majority issue , you might have a million people agreeing in a subject but this doesn't mean that their right and the one who differs is wrong.
About my stupid remark about "people of art"
people of art are not the musicians nor the actors or the poets,....People of art are the ones that could easily have every occupation imaginable ,but they have one thing in common they do hold a position and they are the "spiritual guidence" in a society .I used the term in a more poetical
sence than you conceived it and with a sence of humor.
Robert:who are those warez/crackz people that you are talking about , please assist me because i am trying to think but i don't seem to be able to.
Bottom line?People with a different opinion
are stupid, dum , they certainly are not thinking ,their opinion is a load of shit,....hey algo why don't you sentence these people with a death penalty ?
If you are from the states it is legit , you could even call it a law reinforsment measure
and of course the majority there doesn't feel that it's murder , simple justice.perhaps this is what you call an objective opinion?
cheers