123 music store (after weedshare and bmi 1 cent checks)

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Fri Mar 05, 2004 2:30 am

http://easybe.com/feature_list.html

Looks nice but doesn't allow to sell cds or dvds (only mp3..), nor tracking/protecting of your tracks. I think about it and I wonder if the only interest is to get low paypal comissions, or if there is another interest (the "intrenet opens your music to millions of people : i don't really buy that

I tried weedshare as a simple listener, the network is too wide and i didn't manage to hear anything anyway....

[ This Message was edited by: spacef on 2004-03-05 02:33 ]

litmus · Post by **litmus** » Tue May 25, 2004 4:56 pm

Hey. I work with these guys - I write a lot of their stuff and I provided the demo content... i think I can answer a few questions here.

The 1-2-3 Music Store is a sales channel for independent artists and labels. With it, you can sell your music as downloads all over the world. I'm personally quite convinced that it's a good thing (and it's not expensive) but we're meeting a lot of scepticism - a lot of people seem very suspicious of stuff like this... probably rightly so. Anyway, spacef, let's look at your questions...

>doesn't allow to sell cds or dvds (only mp3..)

No, this wasn't the priority for the first release. The great thing about digital distribution are the phenominally low costs for the seller, in this case the artist or label. This is the important thing. Apparently, the next version of the software will include a merchandising feature, so people can also sell "analog" products.

>...nor tracking/protecting of your tracks.

Again, this was a conscious decision. We're not big fans of copy protection. There's always a way to copy (just record it in wavelab) and copy protection is basically a penalty for those people who DO buy the music.

>or if there is another interest
Sure - it's a commercial thing - the main interest is to make a lot of money! ; ) Nevertheless, it really does provide an interesting opportunity for labels and artists to retain control over their music and sell globally. And it's relatively cheap (we all know that musos are misers).

>the "intrenet opens your music to millions of people : i don't really buy that

Well, it's true. The 1-2-3 music Store won't make people come to your website, and it won't make you famous, but it lets you sell your songs all over the world, provides communication management features and it's a steal for the price. Try out the demo - it's well researched and well designed.

OK. Feel free to post again or contact me directly if you have any questions. For anyone reading this, try out the demo and decide for yourself whether it's any good or not - http://easybe.com/demo.html

thx for listening!

Post by **hubird** » Tue May 25, 2004 8:38 pm

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Wed May 26, 2004 4:40 am

hi litmus

let me start with my favourite quote
...hey man, it's showbizzness. No business - no show

which applies to musos as well as to distribution (whatever channel choosen)

imho the 1-2-3 is a good business idea, for the distribution - and on the expense of the (so-called) artists...
1-2-3 doesn't pretend it can do anything for them (in facts - which is correct), yet the site succeeds in spreading a 'home' feeling among the readers - good job on that.

There's only one business example (model):

Julie goes to your concert... and she can... and she does...
if she would, I'd sell her the CDs right at the entrance of the party

sidenote: is the female customer-ess intended to please the (highly probable) majority of male musicians in a certain way ?

Most 'net performers' don't give concerts at all and even if they did, the audience would be far too small for a follow-up business model à la 1-2-3.

It is correct that the investment of 50 bucks isn't much and there's the possibility (the sooner, the more likely) to get the investment back - but well, I could better spent them at a Casino with an almost 50% chance to leave with 100.

Which brings us to Paypal a $0.3 charge to be safe plus 3% of the amount - exactly what ALL Casinos on this planet make their living from, and not a bad living btw...
In case you wonder: about 30 numbers are evenly distributed on 2 colors, but one number (zero) 'disturbs' the equality, just enough to make the bank's profit - applied statistics, nothing else.

Paypal is on the profitable side with this + 3% and 1-2-3 makes a good deal on the hopes of their customers - a similiar model as the Casinos offer, you may enter with hope, but someone else makes the profit, no matter with what you leave.

Aside from that 1-2-3 wouldn't be such a bad idea as a distribution channel, IF there was a kind of service making artists better known (simplyfied).
Exactly THAT is excluded, you'll need your own advertisement and website etc.
And it's a fairy tale that music is bought just because 'it is good'...

cheers, Tom

mr swim · Post by **mr swim** » Wed May 26, 2004 11:03 am

Having had a good root around I think this is a bloody good idea. If I was a) writing any music at all and b) thought I could sell ANY of it, then I would almost certainly use this system.

My only thought: is it possible to customize the 'look' of the shop ? I couldn't see any way on the admin page demo, but then maybe I'm being blind

Will.

litmus · Post by **litmus** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:55 pm

Hey Tom, Will, all...

Will, thanks for your support and yes you can customize the look of the shop - if you can work with HTML, it's not a big deal. Tom, I had to read your post twice - the first time it seemed REALLY negative; the second time less so. Thank you for taking the time, anyway. It's good to get feedback. I think it's a bit unfair to compare easybe to a casino (!!!), though. I mean, what the store does is provide a distribution channel. It can't make you popular. PR work isn't something you can do with software, unfortunately - if it was, i would have bought it already, believe me. There are services around - i recently talked to a gentleman called Dave Hooper at kathode Ray music - they specialise in promotion and publicity stuff. Anyway, I think there are different ways of seeing things and some people will always focus on what's missing but there are others who focus on what's there. And as far as the 1-2-3 music store is concerned, what's there is really OK.

About the business model, you're right - there is only one scenario described on the site but that's not 'cos it's the only one. I don't quite follow why net based musos should not want to sell their songs online... there's nothing stopping them; even if they don't play live! Another scenario would be the classic semi-professional besonic user - post selected songs or song snippets to muso hosting site and link to your own site where the songs are available in full length and full quality plus additional content. Bands do it all the time but without their own store, they frequently redirect users when it comes to payment which leads to low purchase rates.

I'm going on a bit, aren't I? Tom, hope you don't feel singled out but I wanted to address the issues you raised, which are totally valid. hope I succeeded in that!

thx for listening,
litmus

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 8:44 pm

On 2004-06-01 17:55, litmus wrote:
... I think it's a bit unfair to compare easybe to a casino (!!!), though. I mean, what the store does is provide a distribution channel. It can't make you popular. ...

hi litmus,

I'm ok with any business model that doesn't point a gun in my direction - we all have to make out living someway

But I was very happy to find the Casino comparison - it describes the situation with a stunning precision, up to the percent figure EBay (PayPal) charges.

The deal is on hope (except PayPal and the software sale) - and that's what drives someone in a casino to bet money on numbers.
There's absolutely nothing bad with this.
As long as people PAY for televoting of whatever nonsense, don't even think you're doing the wrong thing

Nevertheless 1-2-3 isn't supplying a distribution channel, as there's no request (yet), so the service obviously is not needed (yet).
As mentioned above: sales on hopes that the situation will change - someway, somehow.

But certainly not on itself and not because someone 'makes good music'...

Honestly, imho the biggest problem on that type of business is that one part of the contractors seems to have a severe problem with 'selling themselves'.

They dream of being rich and famous - why else 'go public on the net' and 'can live of my music...'

You introduce a couple of scenarios, which all require at least a basic demand by the public - and you're honest enough to tell people that a shop software cannot provide this.

There's a missing link, the 1-2-3 model is the second step before the first one.
I'd be concerned it would fail completely, if there wasn't the part of the business model mentioned above.
If 1-2-3 would find (provide) that missing link, the one that draws people's attention and creates a 'must have' feeling - then it could even be a huge success

I know that's beyond the scope of the original concept, but it would be THE point making a difference to similiar services.

cheers, tom

[ This Message was edited by: astroman on 2004-06-02 07:57 ]

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 4:03 am

thanks for the answers litmus. In fact I could use 123 in the future (but I would also like to be able sell "physical" cds, cause i also buy them sometimes

. it's cool to have a box with art, info, credits etc to read (may be i'm a bit old school). but well, there are certainly ways to do it (the only problem is that on, for ex, 7.99 euro/dollars not much is left for the artist after ShareIt/Paypal/Kagi share (+shipment), but may be more than in a classical distribution circuit). see you

[ This Message was edited by: spacef on 2004-06-02 05:18 ]

litmus · Post by **litmus** » Fri Jun 04, 2004 7:10 pm

Me again. : )

Yeah sure, I know what you mean! BUT...

think of the real world. you hear a song you like, you go to the store and buy it, or ask around your friends to see if someone has it already - I guess some people fire up their p2p client and run a search...

Of course, if you don't know that song is out there, you can't hope to buy it. You don't even want to buy it. So for me, this isn't an argument at all for dissing (however politely, gentlemen, it is appreciated!) 1-2-3. No-one claims that HMV is stupid 'cos they only sell music... imagine you went to HMV and they had no tills? Like, you could read about the song you wanted, and maybe listen to a 30 second sample, but there was no way you were going home with that song? This is what a lot of artist websites are like.

The other thing we've not covered yet is the relevance for labels. These guys sell music for a living, promote their artists (at least, they should) and have a specific label identity. A label would be pretty dumb not to sell music from their website, and the 1-2-3 Music Store is a good solution for selling downloads.

Which brings me to your point, spacef - I used to love my vinyl and I needed years to get used to the idea of buying CDs. Then I liked my CDs but we had too many and we needed more space so we packed away all the jewel cases and put the CDs in 6 huge wallets. i didn't want to do it, (my girlfriend's idea) but already a week later, I was pleased that we had. same process with listening to music on my computer etc etc. It does take a bit of getting used to, but people will gradually get used to the idea that digital music doesn't have to have a physical form. Plus there's a whole world of digital content that one could provide instead of a cracked jewel case and a dog-eared inlay. So. I guess I'm just still smarting a bit from the casino thing... ; )

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Sat Jun 05, 2004 7:08 am

yes, i think you have a point (and most major labels go this way too, well, kind of...). (and there are people who are willing to support actively the artists they like, in a way or another, so i guess there is not much to loose...).

edited : so, thanks to help the independants with this tool.

[ This Message was edited by: spacef on 2004-06-05 13:18 ]

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Sat Jun 05, 2004 4:38 pm

well, I wouldn't call it 'dissing' 1-2-3

The business model itself is pretty smart - it allows the provider of the service to survive even if a number of clients fail, and still keep up the offer for possible future clients.
A 'traditional' record label would probably go down under such circumstances.

My comments weren't intended to bash 1-2-3 for bashing's sake, but more to trigger some rethinking on the clients side about their own situation

It's a well known dilemma that people tend to hang their hopes on tools once they are available and forget about the most basic stuff.
Btw there seems to be an interesting feature in the current issue of german Keyboards mag about alternative market channels for music.

cheers, Tom

[ This Message was edited by: astroman on 2004-06-05 17:40 ]