Multitimbral second computer

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Tue Mar 11, 2003 5:56 am

I'm looking for links/experiences with standalone vst(i) hosts to use a second computer as a multimbral synth/effect.

The aim is to be able to send 16 midi channels to a second computer whith vstis, possibly to add effects, just as you would do in cubase instruments tracks.

Cubase vst/sx allow to do this : vst with activation of multirecord, sx too (but i only have 1 sx licence). It could be a bit too complicated to set up...

I found out that VAZ 2010 or VAZ modular allow to host vstis, but it's quite limited from what i've tried (demos), eventhough it has a prety fat analog synth emulation.
http://www.software-technology.com/

There's also Chainer, wich seems the perfect thing.
http://www.xlutop.com/html/chainer.html

I heard of steinberg Vstack, but i also heard that system link has nothing more than a simple midi connection (it seems it doesn't work anyway)....

Any other idea ?

thanks

[ This Message was edited by: spacef on 2003-03-11 05:57 ]

borg · Post by **borg** » Tue Mar 11, 2003 6:11 am

have you tried plogue bidule? i haven't, but people on the ableton forum think very highly of this app (ableton has no vsti support of its own...)

http://www.plogue.com/bidule/

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Tue Mar 11, 2003 6:54 am

wow, the "bidule" looks wicked ! a kind of modular, it's could be better than spark fx machine.... i'll try that and let you know...

... in the meantime, other suggestions welcome.

[ This Message was edited by: spacef on 2003-03-11 08:11 ]

samplaire · Post by **samplaire** » Tue Mar 11, 2003 8:18 am

You can find some here: http://www.kvr-vst.com/host.php

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Tue Mar 11, 2003 3:58 pm

mmmh, actually i wonder why i read many negative reviews about vstack (seems problems are about spdif), but i read here that it seems to work...

jupiter8 · Post by **jupiter8** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 12:01 pm

I believe people were really disappointed with the initial midi specs, where you couldn't send different midi channels to different instruments. I know i was.
But that has been fixed now.

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 1:30 pm

Yes, and from what I read, I think that people were expecting much more from what was annouced, it's still difficult to know how it performs (no demo)
--
I would like to ask you a few questions if possible :
- can you send a midi clock to VSTis in Vstack : I read in an old post that you could not to that : your tempo synched-modulations are (were) useless in vstack.
- From what you says, I understand that now you can use midi channels freely (ie, like controlling 16 different vsti).
- I'm just curious to know if you can use SX automation to control something in vstack (that should be possible if i beleive steinberg initial statement about vstlink).

Thanks in advance if you can enlight me.

[ This Message was edited by: spacef on 2003-03-13 14:26 ]

[ This Message was edited by: spacef on 2003-03-13 14:27 ]

jupiter8 · Post by **jupiter8** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 9:51 am

Oh yeah, i forgot. It doesn't sync to midi clock!!!! You can't sync any of your VSTi stuff to the "main" computer.

Yes, now you can use 16 VSTi from a single midi port.

I'm not sure about the System link integration. They say you can control this and that, but how? To me, system link seems like midi protocol going thru spdif,adat instead of regular midi cable. Never really understand the fuss about it. But i could be wrong about that.

So my guess is you can send midi messages from SX to Vstack to control it but that's about it.

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Sat Mar 15, 2003 10:11 am

I thought that the whole point about system link is that it keeps sample-accuracy on the 2nd computer.

I can't comment on whether it works or not however, as I'm not a Cubase user.

I can, however, recommend Plogue Bidule very highly... it seems to be the equivalent of SFP for native systems

... freely patchable MIDI and audio.

peace

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Mon Mar 17, 2003 4:57 am

>>> Never really understand the fuss about it. But i could be wrong about that.

I read somewhere that in 1996, system link was annouced as a way to communicate midi AND audio between several computers. It also seems that they abused the marketing annoucements when it was released because you understood that there was a way to bounce audio, automation etc....

Now it's clearer.

Bidule : it didn't work here, but I didn't play too much with it and didn't not take the time to look into the soft. It does look cool etc but a bit too advanced for what i want to do (which is basically to have something very simple).
Unfortunately, it doesn't allow more than one card driver at a time (you can't have "wave dest 2 for ex) ...
Well it was hellpful.

I contacted XUlTOp chainer makers they said that eventhough tempo is only supported internally for the moment (you have a tempo in chainer) they plan to support receiving midi clock in the future. that would be great.

I didn't know it was so hard to support midi clock (did they simply thought about it ???...)

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Mon Mar 17, 2003 4:59 am

>>>>is that it keeps sample-accuracy on the 2nd computer.

Someone on cubase forum said that chainer was dependant on the latency of the card of the second computer.

So i asked if Vstack was able to deal and remove that latency , but had no answer....

orbita · Post by **orbita** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 3:20 pm

Im using system link with Cubase SX and VStack and it works very nicely.

System link is much more than just midi over spdif/adat. It sample locks both computers so there is NO latency difference between them.

Using VStack and system link, you CAN sync synths and effects to the master machine, it happens automatically. Change the tempo on the main machine and the various effects you have on the VStack change appropriately so you can run clocked delays etc. I think this requires system link - I do not think it will work over straight midi and midiclock.

The latency of the final output is the sum of the latencies of both computers so it is important that both pcs have soundcards with low latencies.

I use and RME 9636 in one pc running at 3ms and my creamware cards running at 4ms giving a total latency of 7ms. More than good enough.

If I was using a Midi based host like console or chainer, there would be a latency different between the two computers which would be the midi latency + the audio latency of the second pc.

The one thing missing that would be nice is to use it as an separate effects processor. Unfortunately VStack doesnt seem to support any form of audio input. You would need another full version of cubase sx or vst to do this.

Michu · Post by **Michu** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 12:00 am

Not a standalone host but very cool

in FXpansion's skunkworks you will find Simple VST Host. It may or may not work for you , but it's free

[ This Message was edited by: Michu on 2003-07-03 01:01 ]