VST 2.0 in Cubase 14

[Wolferich]

Cubsae 14 has been release this week and there is a new option to work with VST 2 Plug-Ins. Until now only VST 3 Plug-Ins could be used which excluded the scopeworld from the use inide Cubase. I would have tested the functionality but my Pulsar-cards are hosted in another PC. Did somebody already test the new option?

[nebelfuerst]

I left cubase some years ago, but I'm not sure what you really mean.
Using scope as a VST inside a DAW was a function of the eary years. "XTC-mode", as far as I know.
I never understood the sense of this function, as you also can use ASIO/ADAT to interface to DAW, while hosting the scope synths within scope and the VSTs within your DAW.

[Wolferich]

I am using Scope through ADAT in Cubase. Nevertheless, I would prefer to use Scope-pluIns inside Cubase.
I had this in the past and it enden when Cubase excluded VST2 usage. Now this seems to be back and I wonder if this gives new old possibilities in this respect.

[Wolferich]

ISorry, I was unprecise in my last post.

I have Scope cards in a separate computer and Scope is connected through a ADAT-connection with the computer that is running Cubase. I did this because I use the main Computer (with Cubase) for different purposes and didnt want to be restricted by limitations of Scope. Nevertheless, as I said before, I would prefer the old XTC-possibilities e.g like having the scope instruments and effects in Cubase.

[spacef]

Hi There ! I think that it is Steinberg which would like to "forbid/terminate" the use of VST2 in favour of VST3. Therefore, it is not surprising that VST2 plugins do not show up in Cubase. I don't know the logic of this, as VST2 work in most other DAWs.

For scope plugins, it would need XTC plugins to be VST3 but I have no idea how this could be made (as far as I remember, *.dev just needed to be renamed as "*.dll" and placed into a specific folder to work in XTC mode, but it has been a very long time since I did not use XTC). I doubt it would work by renaming the *.dll as *.vst3 though (no idea if it would work, i suppose not due to the extra features of VST3).

I don't use XTC but I understand the need to insert Scope plugins in a VST chain (like in between various stuff).
This would allow to use Scope effects in-between vst plugins (for example).

I was looking at this thread to know more and see if reinstalling XTC is interesting (I am looking for info about latency compensation, ie, does it xompensate ASIO latency everyime an XTC effect is inserted? ) .

[fra77x2]

Don't bother with xtc mode. Don't say to other users to try it.

You sound like a novice in these matters why you keep giving your advice about stuff you don't know?

If you want to apply vst effects to scope send your audio to an asio input and monitor it in your daw.

If you like to apply scope effects to things in your daw send it to an asio channel... it sound like alphabet.

[Bud Weiser]

... VST2 in favour of VST3. ...

For scope plugins, it would need XTC plugins to be VST3 but I have no idea how this could be made (as far as I remember, *.dev just needed to be renamed as "*.dll" and placed into a specific folder to work in XTC mode, but it has been a very long time since I did not use XTC). I doubt it would work by renaming the *.dll as *.vst3 though (no idea if it would work, i suppose not due to the extra features of VST3).

VST3 is acceptable for VSTfx plugins, but not for VSTi.
With VST3, there are no MIDI program changes possible and I´d hate to lose this feature for SCOPE synths !
I play keys and need MIDI program changes.

So please S|C, never ever make SCOPE synths VST3 !

I don't use XTC but I understand the need to insert Scope plugins in a VST chain (like in between various stuff).
This would allow to use Scope effects in-between vst plugins (for example).

I was looking at this thread to know more and see if reinstalling XTC is interesting (I am looking for info about latency compensation, ie, does it xompensate ASIO latency everyime an XTC effect is inserted? ) .

AFAIK, XTC doesn´t work in SCOPE v7 at all.
Instead, it was announced to become a dedicated application we´ve never seen up to now.

Currently I´m happy w/ SCOPE standalone,- even 32Bit PCI SCOPE v7 on the HP server !
For native VST, there´s unlimited count of plugins out there,- freeware, commercial, cheap and expensive,- some very good ones also in the freeware department.

I´d prefer getting the for long announced new SCOPE ASIO and Wave drivers and SCOPE 64Bit fixes instead wasted development time for XTC and VST3.
I also think given VST2 plugins are easier to compile when CLAP is the target.
And for sure, Steinberg will refuse to support CLAP.
But others like Bitwig and Reaper do and there will be more to come.

We have to overcome Steinberg VST dictatorship.



Bud

[fra77x2]

I read morons dictatorship...

You sound like a stuck tape recorder Bud. Whats the problem?

[spacef]

AFAIK, XTC doesn´t work in SCOPE v7 at all.

Ok, latest scope 7 installation asked if I wanted XTC (which I declined). So I thought it was something functional.
I wanted to check wether it worked with the Bertom Eq analyser on scope plugins , for some personal projects ( ) , as it doesn't work as fine when routing back and forth through asio.

EDIT: finally made it work fine by deactivating "Auto Sync" on the analyser plugin.

[fra77x2]

So you claim to be scholastic... you test if every functtionality works right because you are such a perfectionist, heh?

and you can't route signals to monitor in your daw?

I laugh

[fra77x2]

When xtc mode worked right ( back in years) it sucked. The latency was unacceptable and the resources where sparred for a fools dream.

I have tested it a lot it was the opposite of using scope as a low latency interface. And it ruined both scope and the daw.

routing the signals back and forth to the system is wrong way of using it. it survived as a marketing point. don't use it. forget it. find a way to make a scope system that is actually fun to work with. It is very easy. I am curious why you keep "testing" these ttthings. Perhaps because you have never tested it anyway in the last 20 years. You think by talking about nonsese you create some kind of attention on planetz but its the wrong kind of attention. Its everything that doesnt work in scope that somehow you like to use them.. Knocking your head on the door type of situation.

[fra77x2]

Come on people I am kidding. Of course you are not morons. Its Christmas, have your fun relax and do whatever you like i mean yeah check xtc mode of scope, yes its cool, we have all done it. You may find a curious personal stressful procedure of doing things. But if anyone is in some kind of a furry, and well dont think its a good idea sparring time without meaning well perhaps he may pass xtc mode. Its useless and pathetic.

[Spielraum]

I tested XTC briefly in millenium when it was integrated into SFP. My assumption that the "ingenious" modular routing would remain usable in parallel was not confirmed. Perhaps some people have forgotten that? XTC made Pulsar/SFP/Fusion/Scope extremely inflexible in routing, and I put my vision on paper years ago... Scope only reveals its true strength through its modular structure in non-XTC mode!

Ps. fra77x2 and Bud: why so agro in your texts?

[fra77x2]

stuggling with level A english? Do you still live behind the iron curtain?

[Spielraum]

Frohe und Besinnliche Zeit zwischen den Jahren!

[spacef]

Cubsae 14 has been release this week and there is a new option to work with VST 2 Plug-Ins. Until now only VST 3 Plug-Ins could be used which excluded the scopeworld from the use inide Cubase. I would have tested the functionality but my Pulsar-cards are hosted in another PC. Did somebody already test the new option?

I just remembered and tested in Studio One the "pipeline" fx which allows to insert external gear in an FX chain. You just set an ASIO Send and Return channels. So I have been able to insert a Scope EQ in the middle of VST insert chain.

I saw that it also exists in cubase and is called "External Fx" (google search results link).

It allows to have XTC functionality + keep the routing of Scope, as long as you have ASIO in/outs available.
Best of both worlds in my opinion.

[Spielraum]

i like routing about "External FX/Instrument" in Cubase together with "External FX/Instrument" in Scope.
calibrating the DAW "external" setting is easy to handle.
that's a good combination here. with Asio IO 64 channels. also via adat and zlink. XITE <digital/analog> PCI.

all without XTC.
Ps.: "External FX/Instrument" in Cubase together with "External FX/Instrument" in Scope are "XTC-Dummys" without losing Scope flexibility, i think...

[pranza]

okay, a word from someone who is using XTC as a primary means of working with Scope
first of all, that's how other dsp cards work - say, TC powercore (RiP), and UAD. it's the only way they work and ppl paid money solely for that single and only means of function. there is no point in arguing unless one is from the moon or farther than the moon - it's just how dsp plugins work. XTC mode (or vst wrapper in generic terms).
now, monkeying with asio (and scope asio is buggy and archaic indeed) prevents one from using other audio interface for audio i/o, also prevents settings recall from within daw and so you then have two places to look at and take care of.
also, monkeying with ASIO to get stuff from daw elsewhere to be processed implies using Scope mixers too... unless one wants even more roundtrips... and scope mixers have another set of issues, changing phase relations between channels between sessions being most severe. i guess i shouldn't even start about latency compensation...;D

spaceF, did you say you had XTC in Scope v7??? i thought it was not present there. is it? that's the reason i didn't go for v7.

[pranza]

anyway, it would be great if someone would take care of the XTC and Scope BUGFIXING in general. crowdfunded perhaps?
i wonder if it's possible without some source code from S|C

i sometimes have to go through like 10 crashes to get to that lucky boot where both vdat x64 and XTC works - takes good half an hour at least!

a race condition or allocation of resources to wrong place or what not is happening somewhere
but if you get past it, you can have a stable and consistent system for a month or more! if it doesn't crash on first load of vdat or xtc plug.
first i try vdat - if that one doesn't crash, big chances XTC will be OK too.

this is ridiculous but that's the only way to use goodie scope plugs in a daw
ranting that this wasn't ironed out even in the nineties and so dragged to these days and should be abandoned doesn't help - we need a solution
and solution is NOT an asio back and forth or ADAT cables to the kitchen.

[pranza]

and regarding this - "The latency was unacceptable and the resources where sparred for a fools dream."

the latency is what you set at ULLI (which applies to ASIO too) - in my case it's 128 samples. how many native plugins do you know that have just 128 samples of latency? in my system, other plugins have to "catch up" with XTC, not vice versa.
regarding resources - there is nothing of extraordinary especially if one uses MultiFX plugin in which one can load several Scope plugs in a chain. that's nothing more than what asio i/o would consume - one roundtrip to the card.
if you do it all recklessly then of course it's possible to run out of resources even with 30 dsps.. and it's even more likely to happen if you do asio out to scope and use scope for mixer and every single effect (which makes no sense as there are also good plugins from other places than scope).
i have never run out of resources with xtc in daw
and the only latency problems arise when i use some extremely large buffer stuff (like linear phase EQs) together with XTC and in paralellel channels - then Scope introduces dropouts as due to extreme latency compensation taking place...