Minimax announce + comments

bosone · Post by **bosone** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 10:48 am

from CW newsletter: (my comments at the end...)

Minimax - A Legend Reborn

It's one of the most famous and popular synthesizers of all time: the Moog Minimoog(TM). With the brand new Minimax synthesizer, an exact and complete emulation of this legend is now available for the first time.
Minimax boasts all of the properties of the famous original: the powerful sound of the oscillators and the unique filters, the lightning-fast envelopes and the characteristic saturation of the mixer section, and even features like filter FM and internal feedback. Even the positions and the behavior of the controls agree with those of the original! So if you happen to still have any of your old Minimoog(TM) sound sheets, you can set them up on the Minimax and finally store them as presets!
The accurate 1:1 modeling is made possible by newly-developed algorithms which are completely free of aliasing, and by the high-precision 'Circuit Modeling' technique, in which all important sound-influencing elements in the original circuit are painstakingly modeled. Thus Minimax is unlike anything that has come before. Minimax does not emulate just parts of the synthesizer - Minimax IS the instrument.
Dr. Walker, the worldwide renown figurehead of German Electro Music about the Minimax: "4 me the minimax is simply the BEST sounding virtual analog synth i've ever heard! i don't want 2 miss that beast in my productions ever again! - by the way: my old minimoog d is on sale now!"
Let the unbelievably fat, powerful and direct sound of the Minimax inspire you now by testing the free demo version. You'll find it ready to download in the CreamWare Online Shop. Or just go for it! Because if you move fast you can get the Minimax for only 199 Euro instead of 249 Euro. However, this introductory offer is available for a short time only.
You'll find much more information, sound examples and opinions on the new Minimax synthesizer at http://www.creamware.com.

**********

...
it seems that "virtual" instruments provided by NOAH will be available also to SFP users! (and this is a good move by creamware!!)
but i think most of us (i may be wrong!) are a bit tired about vintage reproduction of synths and effects (vinco and this minimax, for example). in my opinion, pulsar environment have GREAT possibilty and CW should develop a great sounding synth or FX differecnt from all the one previoulsly produced. something new like the lightwave or the vectron... or maybe they could recreate something like Roland JV1080 or the soundcanvas, or other hardware stuff, but i'm tired of analog subtractive synth! (this is my opinion, of course!)

another thing... Minimax seems HUGE on DSP... they say that the polyphony is about 1 voice per DSP... you add the sampler, another synth, a couple of FX and you overload!!! please... lower some price, either of the hardware or of the software... i will not buy a CW synth if i can not use it at its maximum due to dsp overload problem... and if i have money i would buy another card, not a synth... (used LUNA=300 euro, CW synth=200euro...) or perhaps an external used expander (for 300-400 euro you can buy something very good, you have 32/64 poliphony and don't worry about DSP!

)

my two cents..

subhuman · Post by **subhuman** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 11:04 am

I think you have a few good points, but remember: The original MiniMoog is *MONO* -- so for the "most accurate" reproduction, on a Pulsar2 you'll still have 5 DSPs left...

About hardware prices... well maybe you need to look around at some of the powerPulsar specials.

e-scape · Post by **e-scape** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 1:48 pm

I think its great news!!!
i wanr more vintage gear, not like the standard pulsar vintage synthesizer, but like minimax and the prophet, maybe they eat a lot dsp, but who cares if the sound is that good. The vinco is so far the best thing that happened to the pulsar..........Lets have more.
cosmos

thermos · Post by **thermos** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 2:00 pm

i hope they will release the b3 emu soon too.

bosone:
i agree with you on the jv1080, a dedicated sound module type synth would be great. but maybe we should aim a litle higher than jv1080, maybe something closer to a xv5080 or a triton
for this they should make a dedicatred board with onboard ram (pcm memory)

[ This Message was edited by: thermos on 2002-07-11 15:05 ]

Ganool · Post by **Ganool** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 2:26 pm

I must agree. The new Minimax seems very cool indeed. I like the sound of it... if fact it made me remember the two other Moog-clones included with the Pulsar-package, and used the MkII in one of my upcoming songs. Very good indeed!

Carl.

dehuszar · Post by **dehuszar** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 2:37 pm

They do... it's called a SCOPE Board(or PowerPulsar, or ScopeSRB)

for this they should make a dedicatred board with onboard ram (pcm memory)

[ This Message was edited by: thermos on 2002-07-11 15:05 ]

Post by **Guest** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 4:42 pm

they do but it's not in use

On 2002-07-11 15:37, dehuszar wrote:
They do... it's called a SCOPE Board(or PowerPulsar, or ScopeSRB)

for this they should make a dedicatred board with onboard ram (pcm memory)

[ This Message was edited by: thermos on 2002-07-11 15:05 ]

Post by **Guest** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 5:45 pm

Good for those who don't have to pay the bill.

ther are too many minmoog emultions, and for 200EUR is too much for such simple thing, nothing inavative.Maybe it will sounds exactly the same but how much will really care to have exact minimoog sounds in their tracks? sometimes or manytimes, samples are good enough.
And for the overpriced creamware hardware, who would want to spend 200EUR for getting max5~6 voice with no other effects on 6DSP?
even nowaday hardwaresynth can have at least 6~34 voice with 10~56 effects running.

On 2002-07-11 14:48, cosmos wrote:
I think its great news!!!
i wanr more vintage gear, not like the standard pulsar vintage synthesizer, but like minimax and the prophet, maybe they eat a lot dsp, but who cares if the sound is that good. The vinco is so far the best thing that happened to the pulsar..........Lets have more.
cosmos

[ This Message was edited by: Late on 2002-07-11 18:58 ]

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 5:53 pm

Demo sounds are impressive, but I agree with Bosone: the market is getting pretty saturated with retro emulations. But of course there's always room for quality! And if there was ever an emulation of the Korg MonoPoly I'd be first in line to buy.

But I'd also really like to see something a bit more advanced than the standard ADSR setup. NI's Absynth comes to mind: with its complex envelope controls you really can get sounds not even remotely possible with any other synth. It is unique.

Minimax? Haven't we already got multiple Moog emulations?

thermos · Post by **thermos** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 7:11 pm

maybe theres alot of moog and other vintage gear emus availible, but wich ones can compare in sound quality with some of the recent sfp releases?

i find it strange that so many involved in music/sound production are more interested in polyphony, amount of reverbs etc. than sound quality.

to me sfp`s strongpoint is the superb quality it can produce (with well written plugs). if i wanted hundreds of synth voices, infinite modulation opptions and numerous reverbs i would go for a native solution, its better suited for this task.

quality will always cost, and its rerly assosiated with "bang for the bucks".
so theres no reason complaining about the prices. vinco, minimax and pro one (to mention the most recent ones) are all top quality and state of the art in vintage emulations and worth every penny.

a sounblaster and all the native software you can get your hands on is alot of fun but it cant compete with the skywalker ranch.

my two cents

thermos

[ This Message was edited by: thermos on 2002-07-11 20:16 ]

algorhythm · Post by **algorhythm** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 7:37 pm

to LATE - your not DXL? Are you SURE?

ratkinson · Post by **ratkinson** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 7:58 pm

Am I missing something here, I thought the Miniscope was supposed to sound like a Minimoog.
I'm at work so haven't tried the demo yet.

bosone · Post by **bosone** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 2:01 am

On 2002-07-11 15:00, thermos wrote:
i hope they will release the b3 emu soon too.

bosone:
i agree with you on the jv1080, a dedicated sound module type synth would be great. but maybe we should aim a litle higher than jv1080, maybe something closer to a xv5080 or a triton
for this they should make a dedicatred board with onboard ram (pcm memory)

i spoke about JV1010 because it is one of the few synth i listen to, but you are sure, we can aim higher! it was just an example!

visilia · Post by **visilia** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 3:32 am

Wow, I must say that I'm really excited about the minimax sound. It's the best analog synth simulation I ever heard. Sure, it's the same old analog sound again, but I never heard it this good. Check out the demo and just listen to these sounds!

cheers,
vincent

visilia · Post by **visilia** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 4:10 am

On 2002-07-12 03:01, bosone wrote:
i spoke about JV1010 because it is one of the few synth i listen to, but you are sure, we can aim higher! it was just an example!

Hai Bosone,

I would like having a kind of 'preset synth' too, but I doubt something like that will ever apear on SFP.

I'm no DSP expert, but I have the feeling that DSP's aren't suited very well for this type of synths. And there would be probably a very high PCI load too when using samples from the main memory.

Can some of the DSP experts around here enlighten us maybe?

cheers,
vincent

King of Snake · Post by **King of Snake** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 6:06 am

On 2002-07-11 20:11, thermos wrote:
i find it strange that so many involved in music/sound production are more interested in polyphony, amount of reverbs etc. than sound quality.
[ This Message was edited by: thermos on 2002-07-11 20:16 ]

I have to agree with you. the minimax is the finest sounding synth on SFP apart from the Pro-One and yes they eat lots of DSP's, but they sound fantastic. These old synths were mono only, so basically you get five or six minimoogs for 200 Euro plus the price of a Pulsar 2, still waaay less then the ridiculous prices of the actualy synths.
On the other hand, I also agree with the need for some "new" stuff, instead of emulation after emulation. There were two moog clones already with SFP, plus a Juno clone, do we need more clones? ATTACK OF THE CLONES!!

Still, the Pro-One, which I would say is the closest competitor, sounds just as good and costs less than half the price. Plus it has more feautures too (sequencer, arpeggiator, no effects though).
I don't think 200 Euro is a high price to pay for a quality synth, but the price difference for comparable products seems a bit big. So maybe the Pro-One is just too cheap

[ This Message was edited by: King of Snake on 2002-07-12 07:56 ]

Ben Walker · Post by **Ben Walker** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 6:53 am

On 2002-07-12 05:10, visilia wrote:

Hai Bosone,

I would like having a kind of 'preset synth' too, but I doubt something like that will ever apear on SFP.

I'm no DSP expert, but I have the feeling that DSP's aren't suited very well for this type of synths. And there would be probably a very high PCI load too when using samples from the main memory.

cheers,
vincent

Isn't that exactly what the Lightwave is? Seems pretty much like the classic ROM based synth, but with lost of nice modulation options. Take the Lightwave up to 4 oscillators and add the ability to load up new banks of ROM samples (like a new expansion card) and you've got a JV**80 haven't you? The Lightwave is capable of all sorts of 'emulative' patches that the Roland S+S synths are so good at.

Ben

thorkell · Post by **thorkell** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 7:08 am

Recreation of old stuff is nice with other things - but I agree with bosone, it would be nice to see something totally new from Creamware. Of course they have done breakthrought things as well - Optimaster is a good example....

visilia · Post by **visilia** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 7:39 am

On 2002-07-12 07:53, Ben Walker wrote:

Isn't that exactly what the Lightwave is? Seems pretty much like the classic ROM based synth, but with lost of nice modulation options. Take the Lightwave up to 4 oscillators and add the ability to load up new banks of ROM samples (like a new expansion card) and you've got a JV**80 haven't you? The Lightwave is capable of all sorts of 'emulative' patches that the Roland S+S synths are so good at.

Ben

Yeah, I like the Lightwave very much and I think it is indeed the closest thing to a JV**80 type of synth, but I wonder how the Lightwave would perform when 1MB+ multisamples are being used?

But the idea of a Lightwave synth with the option to add your own waves sounds really good to me.

Does any of the developers around here know if the Lightwave is an 'open' (editable for developers) device? If so, would it be a lot of work to implement something like Ben suggests?

cheers,
vincent

jupiter8 · Post by **jupiter8** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 8:07 am

On 2002-07-12 08:39, visilia wrote:

Does any of the developers around here know if the Lightwave is an 'open' (editable for developers) device? If so, would it be a lot of work to implement something like Ben suggests?

cheers,
vincent

I think all of the synths are open, but you have to release them for free.
And i don't think it would be that much work to implement it.

I was trying to convince some developers to do so but i did'nt want to nag about it since they give me those fantastic synths for free.

Never bite the hands that feeds you (synths)