I really don't know the details or the inner workings of occupy wall street, but for the most part, it seems like an organized protest. So far it's been contained enough to not have any effect on my life here in NY. My understanding is that it's a protest, practice of freedom of speech and expression, working with NYPD.. Not really sure what exactly the protest is trying to achieve, but whatever.
A couple nights ago though, I saw some very disturbing activity. These were college kids occupying an empty floor in a building.. signs saying something to the effect of "this building has been occupied", etc. Seems it's possible to get all the clearance to do it, and whatever their reason for congregating, it looked like any other protest. But then a group that was just outside the building started attacking a cab, punching the windows with bare fists and lying down in front of the cab. This was very disturbing because as much as protests are about freedom of speech and expression, these people apparently didn't understand how to work the system. It was just a riot, and there was nothing the riot was driving towards.
I really have a bad feeling about occupy wall street. There are many people who want to have a riot, but not a proper protest. (as in, practicing freedom of speech and using civilian liberties) Occupy wall street creates a sense of anarchy, and that could ignite many other smaller riot groups. Then if the riot groups, some more extreme than others, band together, it could become a formidable force and cause widespread chaos.
occupy wall street won't work out
Re: occupy wall street won't work out
the "occupy" movement is funded by George Soros, the EXACT guy that the occupy folks think that they are working against. 
it will work, just not the way that the demonstrators wish it to....
it will work, just not the way that the demonstrators wish it to....
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jksuperstar
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Re: occupy wall street won't work out
I love how "conservative" rags report the "occupy movement" has received (potentially) over $400 million from Soros and sources. If that were true, the kids should get some helmets and gas masks instead of pulling tents out of their parent's garages.
Still, nothing like adding instability to a market when you need some movement to happen.
Still, nothing like adding instability to a market when you need some movement to happen.
Re: occupy wall street won't work out
it's true.
this is nothing new. big money always organizes the opposition as well as the "mainstream". it's the best way to control the final result.
by the way, just because a source is "conservative" or "liberal" doesn't mean that it is truthful or untruthful. both sides are liars and both sides tell the truth. a good example is flouride. for years, the extreme right said that flouride was poinonous and a bad idea. the left said that the right wing was paranoind and didn't want to help people with this helpful chemical. now the left is against flouride because EVERYONE knows that it's toxic(well, almost everyone).
this is nothing new. big money always organizes the opposition as well as the "mainstream". it's the best way to control the final result.
by the way, just because a source is "conservative" or "liberal" doesn't mean that it is truthful or untruthful. both sides are liars and both sides tell the truth. a good example is flouride. for years, the extreme right said that flouride was poinonous and a bad idea. the left said that the right wing was paranoind and didn't want to help people with this helpful chemical. now the left is against flouride because EVERYONE knows that it's toxic(well, almost everyone).
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jksuperstar
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Re: occupy wall street won't work out
No argument there. In this case the humor stems from the fact that there is assumed to be that much money involved with several hundred protestors, and the rags doing the reporting assume the full amount possible in their reports. "Rag" can also mean Rush Limbaugh here.garyb wrote:it's true.
by the way, just because a source is "conservative" or "liberal" doesn't mean that it is truthful or untruthful. both sides are liars and both sides tell the truth.
Re: occupy wall street won't work out
yeah, he's a rag...
Re: occupy wall street won't work out
I'm basically against violence in every of its forms; I should deserve it as a last chance for self defense.
I agree that a certain kind of behaviour strongly delegitimize movements.
As for the usefulness of the movement itself though, I think no social conquest in the past has been achieved without large people movement.
So if our survival, our wellbeing, our dignity really NEED less corruption, more equity in sharing of fiscal pressure, more responsibility for the managerial class when their choices and their guilts affect our lives much, much more than their lives... well, I can see no other way than large people movement to show what people NEED...
Unluckily, today street movements often involves lot of "extreme" people (like soccer "ultras" ready to gratuitous violence); yes, some fringes are often easy to drive... especially if the contingency anyway supports their instincts..
we had some quite heinous examples recently here...
Probably, today more than before the sixties, in the fight against unfair powers, people tends to become like chessmen in a game between opposite power factions, not really a decision-making part of the game.
Probably people, and me too, should have to learn more about chess..
The fair protest, the attempt to unify the opinion for the majority (that's people eventually having mutual rights and interests reduced, but often different views about the way to go), remain the only way, imo
I agree that a certain kind of behaviour strongly delegitimize movements.
As for the usefulness of the movement itself though, I think no social conquest in the past has been achieved without large people movement.
So if our survival, our wellbeing, our dignity really NEED less corruption, more equity in sharing of fiscal pressure, more responsibility for the managerial class when their choices and their guilts affect our lives much, much more than their lives... well, I can see no other way than large people movement to show what people NEED...
Unluckily, today street movements often involves lot of "extreme" people (like soccer "ultras" ready to gratuitous violence); yes, some fringes are often easy to drive... especially if the contingency anyway supports their instincts..
we had some quite heinous examples recently here...
Probably, today more than before the sixties, in the fight against unfair powers, people tends to become like chessmen in a game between opposite power factions, not really a decision-making part of the game.
Probably people, and me too, should have to learn more about chess..
The fair protest, the attempt to unify the opinion for the majority (that's people eventually having mutual rights and interests reduced, but often different views about the way to go), remain the only way, imo
Re: occupy wall street won't work out
large groups of people trying to do the right thing can easily do the wrong thing with bad leadership, since everyone is following the one in front of them and none but the leader knows the destination. i'm reminded of the movie Animal House at the end, when they wreck the parade. one guy bumps the marching band's drum major out of the way and leads the band into a deadend alley, where all the horns get crushed together in the confusion.
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kensuguro
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Re: occupy wall street won't work out
agreed.. the structure I see happening is that even though the core group (the guys who started it, or who are running it in an effective manner) is working to make change, they may quickly be outnumbered by clouded bandwagon joiners. And at some point, the balance may shift, and the whole thing can go into an unintended direction.
As a side note though, I still don't think I understand what the protest is about.. More equality, lessen income imbalance.. something to that effect right? But demanding that in itself seems a bit pointless as equality, fairness, justice can all be defined by whoever that chooses to address it. If the protest were demanding for something explicit, like "do this thing because we have proof that it has a good chance of decreasing income inequality by this much", is a much more compelling argument.
If a group of obnoxious protesters demand for something, they're asking for a bandaid fix.. The protest needs to uncover the fundamental problems, new ways of thinking about the problems and fixing them.. I just see a lot of protesting for protesting's sake. Almost as if people are re-enacting what they visually remember as being an effective protest.
As a side note though, I still don't think I understand what the protest is about.. More equality, lessen income imbalance.. something to that effect right? But demanding that in itself seems a bit pointless as equality, fairness, justice can all be defined by whoever that chooses to address it. If the protest were demanding for something explicit, like "do this thing because we have proof that it has a good chance of decreasing income inequality by this much", is a much more compelling argument.
If a group of obnoxious protesters demand for something, they're asking for a bandaid fix.. The protest needs to uncover the fundamental problems, new ways of thinking about the problems and fixing them.. I just see a lot of protesting for protesting's sake. Almost as if people are re-enacting what they visually remember as being an effective protest.
Re: occupy wall street won't work out
it's more infantile solutions to basic problems only solvable by hard work and the respect of one's fellow man. it's just a bunch of brainwashed, middle class whiners making a mess. it's an adult complaining about mom and dad's rules of the household while living at home without a job.
shut down internation bankers and the federal reserve. that will fix the country's money woes in the long run. it'd really suck in the short term, but when you have a parasite in your body, sometimes poison is the only way to eliminate it. since the parasite is now running all brain functions, the poison is very dangerous, and the parasite wouldn't allow it anyway....
it'd be better if the protesters just went home, worked hard, raised responsible families, ignored consumerism and instead of blindly observing obnoxious laws, treated each other with respect and common sense. that would involve taking personal responsibility for the society, so it won't happen. instead, people want leaders, even if the leaders are the ones that got them into the mess in the first place.
shut down internation bankers and the federal reserve. that will fix the country's money woes in the long run. it'd really suck in the short term, but when you have a parasite in your body, sometimes poison is the only way to eliminate it. since the parasite is now running all brain functions, the poison is very dangerous, and the parasite wouldn't allow it anyway....
it'd be better if the protesters just went home, worked hard, raised responsible families, ignored consumerism and instead of blindly observing obnoxious laws, treated each other with respect and common sense. that would involve taking personal responsibility for the society, so it won't happen. instead, people want leaders, even if the leaders are the ones that got them into the mess in the first place.
Re: occupy wall street won't work out
http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/ ... a50012bf98
...sorry, i feel like I can only be cryptic at now
the last phrase is even spoken sounding like kind of a cross sign, to me... left, right, up, down
Btw, what happened to Zack De La Rocha? Does he's still rapping?
...sorry, i feel like I can only be cryptic at now
the last phrase is even spoken sounding like kind of a cross sign, to me... left, right, up, down
Btw, what happened to Zack De La Rocha? Does he's still rapping?