best way to get VSTi to do microtuning

[kensuguro]

This is a huge problem. There seems to be no centralized way to change the tuning of VST instruments.

From the hardware days, Yamaha, Roland, Korg, etc. put in thought so that all instruments on their workstations could be tuned to an arbitrary scale by system settings.. But some tuning systems aren't not that simple. One of them is the Arabic tuning system and I now need to use this system. Unfortunately, the Arabic tuning system is not as simply picking "arabic tuning" and then go. The tuning system varies with different scales, or maqams, so the problem is quite difficult to solve.
more details on maqams here:
http://www.maqamworld.com/

There is a plugin from Tobybear called Microtuner which takes in .tun files and scala files, but the plugin is buggy and doesn't work at all for me. It works for some files, not others.. very erratic. I did install scala, and am able to create the tunings I need through that. Basically, I have functioning .tun files for the scale I want to use. (bayati shuri, or Karjighar)

I tried Cubase's microtuner midi plugin but that doesn't work for all VSTi. Actually, I couldnt' get it to work for anything... so that's pretty much useless. I got the .tun file to work with Camelaudio Alchemy.. so that's my backup plan, but I'll need to create all the instruments (lutes, reed instruments, etc). Ideally, I'd be able to change the tuning for Synful orchestra, which I am planning to use for strings backing.

Anyway, if there's anyone who has experience with using VSTi for mideastern music, please teach me how to get this to work. After all the fuss about microtuning in the 70's, you'd think the newest digital music software would be built with it in mind..

Btw, after carefully studying the Arabic tuning system, I've grown to deeply appreciate microtuning and thinking of melodies for non-western scales. It's a new language and calls for new ideas. It pisses me off how the VSTi world is completely inadept at handling these concepts.

[garyb]

simple instruments-complex music


complex instruments-simple music


hmmm...

[siriusbliss]

I don't know of ANY VSTi's that respond fast enough to pitch-change/mod readjustments when using externally controlled microtuning.

If you're on facebook, you can search for the Xenharmonic group, and there you'll find tons of people doing viking, 19-tone, 22-tone, equal, etc. - but MOST of them are biased towards hardware.

I've often considered just getting a H-Pi tuning box.
http://www.h-pi.com/TBX1intro.html

Have fun,

Greg

[dante]

I had microtuning with my old Yamaha TX81Z. But Ive never seen it since. I just assumed the reason it hasn't been carried over into virtual implementations is that there was not enough take up from the hardware days.

[valis]

Logic does microtuning with its own instruments, and you can change center pitch etc but I don't think you can do more than 12 notes per octave or a difference of more than 100cents...I forget. Max has some custom patches I've seen over the years to do quite a lot here, but you're going to be attaching it to other Max instruments. There's been a few tools for Bidule too...

[ChrisWerner]

For an egyptian part in a track I used Kontakts microtuning recently but within Kontakt only. Maybe it is possible to sent it via Kontakts Midi out to other vstis ?

Also I have in a far corner of my head, that home grown sounds do a lot with mircotuning.
hgsounds.com

[kensuguro]

so far, I've found these:

cubase - microtuner midi insert only works with particular synths (none of mine)

Tobybear microtuner - buggy, won't work with my .tun file

Kontakt - via script, works within kontakt

Camelaudio Alchemy - reads .tun files just fine, but don't have instruments I need

Yellowtools Independence - internal support for arbitrary tuning.. I bought it but can't download the 70gb lib because their servers are fxcked up

Quantum Leap RA - does microtuning internally. It's expensive for one time use tho, since RA is so focused on exotic oriental instruments. I also don't need 8mic setup with millions of samples..

max/msp + Live - I guess I can build a patch, but it's too much work for just one project. I mean, it's a 30' clip for chrissakes..

And there are a whole bunch of other synths that individually can deal with .tun files, like spectrasonics synths, etc.. I'm just amazed how little support there is considering how cliche microtuning is in terms of electronic music. Now I kind of know why some people say they do microtonal music as if it's something groundbreaking.

[ChrisWerner]

Well I would have a unregistered original RA version to sell. It is the older version, which came out first. No multi mic thingies. I never used the kompakt version of it, I load everything in Kontakt, which is fine.

PM if you are interested.

[kensuguro]

I've never really checked out his stuff, but turns out a set of free VSTi from Safwan Matni internally does quarter tones

http://smatni.tripod.com/safwanmatnivstplugins/

The instruments aren't mutlismapled or anything fancy, but it gets the job done I think. It's sad the strings one has such a long attack built into the sample... but overall it's better than having to hunt around for sample libs containing oud, zona, or any of the instruments of the arab world.