Is it possible to still have an old creamware card fixed if need be such as if a capacitor blows or are there DIY guides available?
Thank you all forum
Getting old cards serviced
Re: Getting old cards serviced
You can send 'em back to soniccore or search here for stuff like :
http://forums.planetz.com/viewtopic.php ... =capacitor
http://forums.planetz.com/viewtopic.php ... =capacitor
Re: Getting old cards serviced
yes, they can be serviced. this is not a throw away product.
Re: Getting old cards serviced
Cool, so you think I'd be safe to snap 'em up then!garyb wrote:yes, they can be serviced. this is not a throw away product.
I believe it is best to get a 6 DSP rather than 4, as 3 is not many resources and 14/15 probably harder to get.
Would anyone know how long these things are BTW ?
Re: Getting old cards serviced
i suggest a 14dsp card, if you can afford it. an XITE would be even better. you have to fit your budget(my internet computer has a 3dsp card). assuming that you like it, and that you are somewhat serious about music production, you will want more power.
Re: Getting old cards serviced
hi garybgaryb wrote:i suggest a 14dsp card, if you can afford it. an XITE would be even better. you have to fit your budget(my internet computer has a 3dsp card). assuming that you like it, and that you are somewhat serious about music production, you will want more power.
I think you are right 14 would be the best or xite but the latter is out of my league I'm afraid
Basically a 3 DSP would be ok, but reading the infos here tend to say 4 is a bad combination (together = 7) because the 4 DSP can only work as SRB if I am right so 6 is the minimum unless as you say you use a 3DSP for basic work.
If I've got anything wrong please correct my errors.
Thanks
Re: Getting old cards serviced
no, a 3 and 4 dsp card can run together and you still can use all i/os.
the main reason to avoid a 4 dsp card is that the first generation 4 dsp and 15dsp cards don't work as well with the current mainboards and they don't perform as well compared to the second generation cards. they DO work, however. the other thing is that dsp allocation is better across one big card than two small cards.
the main reason to avoid a 4 dsp card is that the first generation 4 dsp and 15dsp cards don't work as well with the current mainboards and they don't perform as well compared to the second generation cards. they DO work, however. the other thing is that dsp allocation is better across one big card than two small cards.
Re: Getting old cards serviced
Ah now I am starting to understand.
So I gather that first generation boards, as well as 2nd generation (creamware) boards including 3,6 and 14 DSP in totality are not as improved over current "mainboard" designes ie those that are sold from the webshop but in particular it is the 4 and 15 DSP versions to avoid.
It would make sense that current models are improved otherwise why such a massive price difference in what you can get on ebay as to what you buy from the retailer.
Thanks for the enlightenment!
So I gather that first generation boards, as well as 2nd generation (creamware) boards including 3,6 and 14 DSP in totality are not as improved over current "mainboard" designes ie those that are sold from the webshop but in particular it is the 4 and 15 DSP versions to avoid.
It would make sense that current models are improved otherwise why such a massive price difference in what you can get on ebay as to what you buy from the retailer.
Thanks for the enlightenment!
Re: Getting old cards serviced
actually, there are second generation 15 dsp cards.
the second generation 3, 6 14 and 15 dsp cards are all the same, new or old. afaik, there are NO pci boards currently produced. S|C can barely keep up with demand for XITEs at the moment. any pci card will have to be used.
it's my pleasure to pass on what info i have...
the second generation 3, 6 14 and 15 dsp cards are all the same, new or old. afaik, there are NO pci boards currently produced. S|C can barely keep up with demand for XITEs at the moment. any pci card will have to be used.
it's my pleasure to pass on what info i have...
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next to nothing
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Re: Getting old cards serviced
"no, a 3 and 4 dsp card can run together and you still can use all i/os."
Just a heads up, if you want a "minimum" setup, go for a 6 dsp card (those are all 2nd gen). if you REALLY just need mixing and maybe a couple FX, choose a 3dsp rather than a 4 dsp. 3dsp are 2nd gen, and will bring you less hassle when you need more DSP (you will).
If you go for a 15 dsp, check that it is infact a 2nd gen card. aøso check if the seller tries to overcharge because of an included developers licence, as this is nothing you should pay for as it is tied to owner by signature (NDA) or SP (Dev package for earlier versions of scope, non-transferrable).
Just a heads up, if you want a "minimum" setup, go for a 6 dsp card (those are all 2nd gen). if you REALLY just need mixing and maybe a couple FX, choose a 3dsp rather than a 4 dsp. 3dsp are 2nd gen, and will bring you less hassle when you need more DSP (you will).
If you go for a 15 dsp, check that it is infact a 2nd gen card. aøso check if the seller tries to overcharge because of an included developers licence, as this is nothing you should pay for as it is tied to owner by signature (NDA) or SP (Dev package for earlier versions of scope, non-transferrable).
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
Re: Getting old cards serviced
Thanks garyb for the insight you provide.
So if I was to purchase a 6DSP card for example from the website, it would likely be "reconditioned" since some time ago there was a buy back scheme in effect.
I don't know if SC were taking back 4 DSP boards as they (pulsar 1) seem to be the odd ball in the pile and some 15 DSP cards.
It just seems a bit strange what you can pick up a card for privately as it were compared to in the webshop itself, when all you might get is the latest software and a warranty.
Maybe this says something for the exorbitant price of xite and sonic core platform generally.
EDIT: interesting next to nothing saying developer, are those licenses still available and would you need to know a programming language?
So if I was to purchase a 6DSP card for example from the website, it would likely be "reconditioned" since some time ago there was a buy back scheme in effect.
I don't know if SC were taking back 4 DSP boards as they (pulsar 1) seem to be the odd ball in the pile and some 15 DSP cards.
It just seems a bit strange what you can pick up a card for privately as it were compared to in the webshop itself, when all you might get is the latest software and a warranty.
Maybe this says something for the exorbitant price of xite and sonic core platform generally.
EDIT: interesting next to nothing saying developer, are those licenses still available and would you need to know a programming language?
Re: Getting old cards serviced
Is it not the case though that the ASIO driver is different for 1st generation cards such that they use different buffer settings or sizes?next to nothing wrote:"no, a 3 and 4 dsp card can run together and you still can use all i/os."
I've read here before there is a special interface that scope uses to access the kernel mixer which is why the old creameware boards aren't compatible with MAC OS
Re: Getting old cards serviced
no, the driver is the same on all cards of any age.
the card is a world of it's own. the program that runs the card and the gui must be written for each os, as well as the driver which connects the hardware to the software in the computer.
what i was speaking about were Ins and Outs-i/o(s).
can you actually purchase a card on the website? i don't think so. the listing is there, but that doesn't mean that there is product. i don't think it will even take your money for a pci card, but you can write them a quick email and find out. S|C has never discontinued the cards formally, and as you can see, they are still supporting the product fully. it's possible that they will make more cards, they're vertainly popular enough. my guess is that they will likely make a smaller pci-e product.
the card is a world of it's own. the program that runs the card and the gui must be written for each os, as well as the driver which connects the hardware to the software in the computer.
what i was speaking about were Ins and Outs-i/o(s).
can you actually purchase a card on the website? i don't think so. the listing is there, but that doesn't mean that there is product. i don't think it will even take your money for a pci card, but you can write them a quick email and find out. S|C has never discontinued the cards formally, and as you can see, they are still supporting the product fully. it's possible that they will make more cards, they're vertainly popular enough. my guess is that they will likely make a smaller pci-e product.
Re: Getting old cards serviced
If the circuit design is still available, it can't be too much a stretch of the imagination to consider a small manufacturing run unless of course they are all re-manufactured.garyb wrote:can you actually purchase a card on the website? i don't think so. the listing is there, but that doesn't mean that there is product. i don't think it will even take your money for a pci card, but you can write them a quick email and find out. S|C has never discontinued the cards formally, and as you can see, they are still supporting the product fully. it's possible that they will make more cards, they're vertainly popular enough. my guess is that they will likely make a smaller pci-e product.
BTW I haven't actually tried to purchase a "new" card all I did was check the site for currency conversion.
Re: Getting old cards serviced
well, they surely may have made more. since i sell them, i wouldn't mind being able to get them. people are pretty short sighted in their purchases these days. people will spend a lot more on a bunch of little things that sort of fill an actual need and then buy a bunch more little things, rather than just spending the proper amount on the thing which is cheaper in the long run and always fills the need. most would rather have toys than tools.
it's really a shame. S|C products are really pretty high end. i'm still harping on the Oscar for sound in the movie "Gladiator" and the two dudes nominated for "best instrumental" Grammies as well as the fact that the 1/4 of a million dollar Fairlight Constellation used the 6 and 16 dsp cards for it's eq and effects. ProTools H|D will set you back $40,000 without even trying and the XITE is more powerful and flexible for less than a tenth of that(but Scope doesn't have the dedicated hardware controller
). still, people have a hard time understanding the value if they haven't used it, or if they are unfamiliar with hardware and the difference in audio quality compared to software, or if audio is not a primary concern. the product is, as you have seen, hard to describe, and many people don't realize what cool things they can do with it who own it.
ok, now i'm outa control. i would love for S|C to have a card for you. i have 2 14dsp, 2 6dsp, 1 3dsp and 2 4dsp cards. i love 'em and use them every day, and run a small home studio. i began selling them because i just happened to run into the one shop that really new about computers and music and i saw that this was the only product that allowed me to function like a real studio, as much in or out of the box as i chose. it was and is the only realtime system available other than proTools, and for my purposes was more useful. nobody in my area had even seen such a product. since i worked in a music store, i wanted to help spread the word. helping the company that made my favorite audio product only made sense, when the company was so small and needed recognition.
S|C may be small and even a little slow, but they really do make a first class product which you should be able to use a VERY long time. it's not about the computer. if you build a system with the current technology, you will have everything you need to make Grammy quality music, to manipulate audio at a quality sufficient for any professional purpose for until the parts burn up, assuning that you have or at least develope some skills.
it's really a shame. S|C products are really pretty high end. i'm still harping on the Oscar for sound in the movie "Gladiator" and the two dudes nominated for "best instrumental" Grammies as well as the fact that the 1/4 of a million dollar Fairlight Constellation used the 6 and 16 dsp cards for it's eq and effects. ProTools H|D will set you back $40,000 without even trying and the XITE is more powerful and flexible for less than a tenth of that(but Scope doesn't have the dedicated hardware controller
). still, people have a hard time understanding the value if they haven't used it, or if they are unfamiliar with hardware and the difference in audio quality compared to software, or if audio is not a primary concern. the product is, as you have seen, hard to describe, and many people don't realize what cool things they can do with it who own it.ok, now i'm outa control. i would love for S|C to have a card for you. i have 2 14dsp, 2 6dsp, 1 3dsp and 2 4dsp cards. i love 'em and use them every day, and run a small home studio. i began selling them because i just happened to run into the one shop that really new about computers and music and i saw that this was the only product that allowed me to function like a real studio, as much in or out of the box as i chose. it was and is the only realtime system available other than proTools, and for my purposes was more useful. nobody in my area had even seen such a product. since i worked in a music store, i wanted to help spread the word. helping the company that made my favorite audio product only made sense, when the company was so small and needed recognition.
S|C may be small and even a little slow, but they really do make a first class product which you should be able to use a VERY long time. it's not about the computer. if you build a system with the current technology, you will have everything you need to make Grammy quality music, to manipulate audio at a quality sufficient for any professional purpose for until the parts burn up, assuning that you have or at least develope some skills.
Re: Getting old cards serviced
you can get a used card from someone here on pz, if nowhere else, i'm sure...
Re: Getting old cards serviced
You are one dedicated user garyb that is for sure!
Regarding what you are saying about "toys" well maybe I've been a bit guilty, but most things I still use one way or another, but bear in mind PCI is pretty old school and won't work in a new generation MAC so obviously SC made the shift with xite but by using PCIe without the need for a desktop machine, hence the portability factor not present in old gen technology.
Anyways I've got a bit of old gear, I actually work the way you describe, bringing back analog inputs via digital converters (yamaha GO44) since my main sound device (roland sonic cell) does not have a digital i/o. I balance the outputs of an X-station with an SMPRO unit, since I compose music and next year maybe there will be a product such as Kurzweil quality but in a desktop module format.
I also use a Layla 3g which sends all the VST stuff to an analog desk, where I mix back with the roland but as well I use a powercore, so was hoping to "boost" my sonic arsenal as they marketing hype would have me saying hence my interest in S|C platform.
Of course I could just use a 6DPS card and be done with it but that's not how I want to work with all due respect since I like to watch TV as well actually, documentaries and so on. I don't work for others so they all can go to hell so to speak.
While I dig sonic-core concept, it's not the only thing out there but I've noticed lately improvements to the website and documentation so here's hoping for a more thorough understanding from my end and a more complete descrpiption from theirs (and maybe yours) end.
Regarding what you are saying about "toys" well maybe I've been a bit guilty, but most things I still use one way or another, but bear in mind PCI is pretty old school and won't work in a new generation MAC so obviously SC made the shift with xite but by using PCIe without the need for a desktop machine, hence the portability factor not present in old gen technology.
Anyways I've got a bit of old gear, I actually work the way you describe, bringing back analog inputs via digital converters (yamaha GO44) since my main sound device (roland sonic cell) does not have a digital i/o. I balance the outputs of an X-station with an SMPRO unit, since I compose music and next year maybe there will be a product such as Kurzweil quality but in a desktop module format.
I also use a Layla 3g which sends all the VST stuff to an analog desk, where I mix back with the roland but as well I use a powercore, so was hoping to "boost" my sonic arsenal as they marketing hype would have me saying hence my interest in S|C platform.
Of course I could just use a 6DPS card and be done with it but that's not how I want to work with all due respect since I like to watch TV as well actually, documentaries and so on. I don't work for others so they all can go to hell so to speak.
While I dig sonic-core concept, it's not the only thing out there but I've noticed lately improvements to the website and documentation so here's hoping for a more thorough understanding from my end and a more complete descrpiption from theirs (and maybe yours) end.
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CarvinGuitarFreak
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 4:00 pm
Re: Getting old cards serviced
@ polemic,
You will be hard pushed to find a better audio card than Creamware. I have 3xPII and a Luna, all brought used from ebay, SOS and PlanetZ. Only problem is that none of them came with v4.5 so I still have to pay for V5.0. I'm reluctant to upgrade to this as I have all plugs from the Mix and Synth packages already.
GaryB is right get a 14/15 card as finding a motherboard that can successfully accommodate 3 cards is a bit of a minefield. You will always want more DSP, it's like a drug.
You can pick up PII for around £100-£150. Absolute bargain.
Laters,
CGF
You will be hard pushed to find a better audio card than Creamware. I have 3xPII and a Luna, all brought used from ebay, SOS and PlanetZ. Only problem is that none of them came with v4.5 so I still have to pay for V5.0. I'm reluctant to upgrade to this as I have all plugs from the Mix and Synth packages already.
GaryB is right get a 14/15 card as finding a motherboard that can successfully accommodate 3 cards is a bit of a minefield. You will always want more DSP, it's like a drug.
You can pick up PII for around £100-£150. Absolute bargain.
Laters,
CGF
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********CARVIN GUITARS RULE*********
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********CARVIN GUITARS RULE*********
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Re: Getting old cards serviced
you even might insert some old fx-units to add character as the Sonic Cell on it's own is among the most sterile (boring) sound sources I ever listened to (returned mine after 3 days - I generally like the Roland stuff)polemic wrote:You are one dedicated user garyb that is for sure!
... Anyways I've got a bit of old gear, I actually work the way you describe, bringing back analog inputs via digital converters (yamaha GO44) since my main sound device (roland sonic cell) does not have a digital i/o. I balance the outputs of an X-station with an SMPRO unit...
digital doesn't always rule...
just as a sidenote: RME has a (well deserved) great reputation, but my RME 9652 does NOT support current multimedia stuff - only the HDSP version doesOf course I could just use a 6DPS card and be done with it but that's not how I want to work with all due respect since I like to watch TV as well actually, documentaries and so on...
thumbs up for SC for keeping the old sh*t alive, even if they hurt themselves sometimes by doing so.
actually a 4 DSP card is a great IO extender for the 3 DSP version.
cheers, Tom
Re: Getting old cards serviced
my internet computer uses a 3 dsp card to recieve audio from my DAW for live broadcast or just to hear a mixdown on my home stereo, it handles windows sounds and it sends a line to my television so that i can watch streaming shows on the net on my television. it also sounds good. 