I've put my hands on my PCR 50 midi keyboard after a while and I've found, in proximity to the two extremities, some keys are not working . After I've hit them repeteadly they've gone to gradually resume functionality, but I'm not sure dynamic sense is still correct.
I'm planning to open the keyboard and try to clean contact surfaces. Since it's the first time I make similar operation, any advice from experienced people is very welcome.
(Though I'm close to post n°1000 I'm still just in the hope this is the right page to post this.. )
faulty keys
Re: faulty keys
you might be able to clean under the rubber contacts with contact cleaner and it may work properly. the rubber contact strips can also be worn out, in which case you'll need to order replacements from Roland.
Re: faulty keys
I have the same contacts. They use these in the M Audio products too.
What will end up happening eventually is that you will have 127 contstant velocity.
This really sucks as they are not worth the cost of replacing the keybed. However I used one of my KS88's that had this happen as a B2003/Synth controller.
That way the other KS88 could remain as the ASIO Sample playback controller.
But eventually this will happen over and over if you play your Controllers with any frequency.
So at least I know you are always jamming now.............
I did notice the heavy action keybeds last a little longer than the synth action keybeds.
My KS88's last for 2 years before the contacts start acting up, then they last until I get pissed off again and turn them into spare parts.
I belong to a Piano forum where guys who have the expensive Fatars have the same issues.
I do classical demos there and other fun mp3's and these guys flipped out when I told them I use a KS88....They immediately piss and moan about the action, and whine about how they can never get the right keybed and action.
I have spent 3 decades trying to find the " right " action. It does not, and will not ever exist.
Besides, these guys who complain the most as if they were Grand Piano experts only post MIDI files they " mastered " in Cubase. The guys who can play usually can play whatever keybed is in front of them.
What will end up happening eventually is that you will have 127 contstant velocity.
This really sucks as they are not worth the cost of replacing the keybed. However I used one of my KS88's that had this happen as a B2003/Synth controller.
That way the other KS88 could remain as the ASIO Sample playback controller.
But eventually this will happen over and over if you play your Controllers with any frequency.
So at least I know you are always jamming now.............
I did notice the heavy action keybeds last a little longer than the synth action keybeds.
My KS88's last for 2 years before the contacts start acting up, then they last until I get pissed off again and turn them into spare parts.
I belong to a Piano forum where guys who have the expensive Fatars have the same issues.
I do classical demos there and other fun mp3's and these guys flipped out when I told them I use a KS88....They immediately piss and moan about the action, and whine about how they can never get the right keybed and action.
I have spent 3 decades trying to find the " right " action. It does not, and will not ever exist.
Besides, these guys who complain the most as if they were Grand Piano experts only post MIDI files they " mastered " in Cubase. The guys who can play usually can play whatever keybed is in front of them.
Re: faulty keys
Against my will, there's other things I must pay attention to, and I wasn't able to open the keyboard and have a look yet.
Being the faulty keys near to the extremities, it let me some hope they aren't worn out, since I very seldom play that keyboard zones.
I didn't play it a lot at all; this last year I played just a couple of time.
I don't think it's related to excessive use.
It's almost five years old though, and the if the rubber ain't a good quality...
If I should buy a new one, it will be an hard decision
Being the faulty keys near to the extremities, it let me some hope they aren't worn out, since I very seldom play that keyboard zones.
I didn't play it a lot at all; this last year I played just a couple of time.
I don't think it's related to excessive use.
It's almost five years old though, and the if the rubber ain't a good quality...
If I should buy a new one, it will be an hard decision
Re: faulty keys
some deoxit d5 spray on a q-tip will probably fix everything. remove the keys, lift the contact strip, clean both sides and reassemble.
Re: faulty keys
Deoxit is the way to go.
I just did the MK88 and now it's wonderful.
Eric.
I just did the MK88 and now it's wonderful.
Eric.
Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for these settings to take effect.
Eric Northwood - Data Recovery Specialist
Eric Northwood - Data Recovery Specialist
Re: faulty keys
those roland contact strips are pretty cheap, really. as long as you can take it apart and get it back together, it's not really a big deal. labor for a good technician is what makes the price too high to not just buy a different cheap keyboard.
Re: faulty keys
Keyboard is gone.
I'm considering E-mu Xboard. Anyone?
I'm considering E-mu Xboard. Anyone?
Re: faulty keys
Ehi, where are you keyboardmen of Planetz?
Re: faulty keys
Personally get the size and number of keys you want.
Action, schmacktion,.....doesn't matter if you actually have had some training.
The most number of knobs, buttons and faders.
The cheapest price.....under 400 bucks.
There's no difference in who makes one really because they are all Chinese pieces of shit, meant to go bad so you have to buy another one.
Or....................buy the ones the " Pros " use because someone paid them to say so and gave them a lifetime of free replacements becasue they will also go bad in 3 years, and come from the same part of the world. The difference is, they cost another 1000 or so dollars.
I chose to buy the most worthless piece of shit I can and then confuse the audience with stickers that make me appear to be a " Pro " and have something most guys can't afford.
Sorry I seem like an asshole, but I am an asshole becasue these manufacturers have had decades to give us a quality product and think we are all morons so they bring us these pieces of shit with different colors and claims. I had the best controller ever made back in 1985, bought the second and third best ones ever made in the 90's....the A90 and MC3000. I have been around since their birth and every decade they get worse and worse and so I have given up on a decent controller. Besides, you either make music or excuses, so I always tell myself to shut the fuck up and play.
Below is my embarassing controller that I don't want anyone to know the name of.
And sadly most players I see in Vegas ask what controller are you using and I tell them the Oberheim XXX File Factor and they nod with approval as if such a piece of shit really exists, so yes I have given up on them also. Most of them push buttons and dance around singing Gay Love songs.
Peace.
Action, schmacktion,.....doesn't matter if you actually have had some training.
The most number of knobs, buttons and faders.
The cheapest price.....under 400 bucks.
There's no difference in who makes one really because they are all Chinese pieces of shit, meant to go bad so you have to buy another one.
Or....................buy the ones the " Pros " use because someone paid them to say so and gave them a lifetime of free replacements becasue they will also go bad in 3 years, and come from the same part of the world. The difference is, they cost another 1000 or so dollars.
I chose to buy the most worthless piece of shit I can and then confuse the audience with stickers that make me appear to be a " Pro " and have something most guys can't afford.
Sorry I seem like an asshole, but I am an asshole becasue these manufacturers have had decades to give us a quality product and think we are all morons so they bring us these pieces of shit with different colors and claims. I had the best controller ever made back in 1985, bought the second and third best ones ever made in the 90's....the A90 and MC3000. I have been around since their birth and every decade they get worse and worse and so I have given up on a decent controller. Besides, you either make music or excuses, so I always tell myself to shut the fuck up and play.
Below is my embarassing controller that I don't want anyone to know the name of.
And sadly most players I see in Vegas ask what controller are you using and I tell them the Oberheim XXX File Factor and they nod with approval as if such a piece of shit really exists, so yes I have given up on them also. Most of them push buttons and dance around singing Gay Love songs.
Peace.
Re: faulty keys
I erroneously treated with contact cleaner the rubber tips and not the contacts board only, so the PCR-50 looked like gone: the fault extended to almost every key.
Then I've taken an E-mu Xboard-49, days ago.
I've a better feel with its keys: they stop firmly at the end of the action, have a fast release and the white ones have no side movements, the blacks just a bit but less than the PCR. Dynamics though, or key action, seem to not suit great with pianos and other velocity crucial sounds; probably I've just to get used. Pitch and mod wheels have a wide action that's really more 'friendly' to me than the PCR joystick.
It comes bundled with Proteus X LE sounds (most of which are more than usable), Ableton Live lite and Xboard software editor. In comparison with PCR-50, the Xboard features splittable keyboard in different key and velocity zones, it allows to choose between different velocity curves and provides channel pressure aftertouch.
Till now looks like it definitely worth the money payed.
I was about to trash the PCR, but... it was a pity to me; The keyboard looks flawless externally and it has got firm, working sliders, buttons (no slider/buttons on the Xboard) and knobs; USB/MIDI features offer a DOUBLE interface, one for the keyboard/controller and an independent one with MIDI in and out that's good to drive external gear from sequencer or software editors (this is not implemented on Xboard: no MIDI in, and the 'thru' function exclude keybord/controller functionality)...
So I made a more in-depth websearch and I found someone that fixed dead keys with graphite. Then I bought some soft lead for propelling pencil.
Today, after a further cleaning with alcohol and cotton wool, I've tried to treat contacts and rubber tips using the lead.
Not exactly a quick task; I've never seen all those screws togheter in a single device; then, 49 springs and keys to remove and still 20 screws to disassemble the contacts board. Sometimes it's good having not an 80 keys
I've treated the higher octave only, till now, then I've re-mounted the thing with the higher 13 keys only, to have a try (with just few screws, of course) and... they work great! Don't know how much time this fix may last, but it works at now and I hope for the other octaves too...
Then I've taken an E-mu Xboard-49, days ago.
I've a better feel with its keys: they stop firmly at the end of the action, have a fast release and the white ones have no side movements, the blacks just a bit but less than the PCR. Dynamics though, or key action, seem to not suit great with pianos and other velocity crucial sounds; probably I've just to get used. Pitch and mod wheels have a wide action that's really more 'friendly' to me than the PCR joystick.
It comes bundled with Proteus X LE sounds (most of which are more than usable), Ableton Live lite and Xboard software editor. In comparison with PCR-50, the Xboard features splittable keyboard in different key and velocity zones, it allows to choose between different velocity curves and provides channel pressure aftertouch.
Till now looks like it definitely worth the money payed.
I was about to trash the PCR, but... it was a pity to me; The keyboard looks flawless externally and it has got firm, working sliders, buttons (no slider/buttons on the Xboard) and knobs; USB/MIDI features offer a DOUBLE interface, one for the keyboard/controller and an independent one with MIDI in and out that's good to drive external gear from sequencer or software editors (this is not implemented on Xboard: no MIDI in, and the 'thru' function exclude keybord/controller functionality)...
So I made a more in-depth websearch and I found someone that fixed dead keys with graphite. Then I bought some soft lead for propelling pencil.
Today, after a further cleaning with alcohol and cotton wool, I've tried to treat contacts and rubber tips using the lead.
Not exactly a quick task; I've never seen all those screws togheter in a single device; then, 49 springs and keys to remove and still 20 screws to disassemble the contacts board. Sometimes it's good having not an 80 keys
I've treated the higher octave only, till now, then I've re-mounted the thing with the higher 13 keys only, to have a try (with just few screws, of course) and... they work great! Don't know how much time this fix may last, but it works at now and I hope for the other octaves too...
Last edited by Cochise on Sun May 30, 2010 12:13 pm, edited 5 times in total.
Re: faulty keys
Guys, I shall probably end up with two keyboards and I neither can really play...
...Neither I succedeed in convincing Jimmy V to take my room for rent for summer
(sorry, this is anyway related to other thread, the 'noise limits' titled one)
...I neither can really play? Still I'm wondering myself if that 'can' stays for 'I don't know how/I'm not skilled' or anyway stays for 'I'm not allowed'.
Sorry again, I'm kind of restless drunk.
...Neither I succedeed in convincing Jimmy V to take my room for rent for summer
(sorry, this is anyway related to other thread, the 'noise limits' titled one)
...I neither can really play? Still I'm wondering myself if that 'can' stays for 'I don't know how/I'm not skilled' or anyway stays for 'I'm not allowed'.
Sorry again, I'm kind of restless drunk.
Re: faulty keys
Way to goXITE-1/4LIVE wrote:Personally get the size and number of keys you want.
I chose to buy the most worthless piece of shit I can and then confuse the audience with stickers that make me appear to be a " Pro " and have something most guys can't afford.
Re: faulty keys
I've completed the job on PCR-50. It's working now, but there's still a wrong velocity response from C and G keys in the lower octave. As Jimmy mentioned, these keys are too sensitive and tend to 127 when not caressed.
As Gary said, rubber strips replacements are not expensive (about 20 Euros), but replacements are available for service centers only and there's none in my town; so considering shipping, repair and replacements, it absolutely don't worth the money.
Actually I've done a blind work; I mean...C key was faulty since more than a year, and G was bad responding too, but I didn't particularly actentioned these keys when I've been doing the work... maybe they should be fixed too...
though...
@Jimmy: is it your keyboard in a custom box?
Considering I'm getting compressed in my room with two keyboards, maybe I should turn it in a MIDI controller box...
As Gary said, rubber strips replacements are not expensive (about 20 Euros), but replacements are available for service centers only and there's none in my town; so considering shipping, repair and replacements, it absolutely don't worth the money.
Actually I've done a blind work; I mean...C key was faulty since more than a year, and G was bad responding too, but I didn't particularly actentioned these keys when I've been doing the work... maybe they should be fixed too...
though...
@Jimmy: is it your keyboard in a custom box?
Considering I'm getting compressed in my room with two keyboards, maybe I should turn it in a MIDI controller box...
Re: faulty keys
I put a felt Piano tuning strip to increase the resistance that people call " heavier " action.
These keyboards are so cheap, a case would cost more.
Thats why I like these worthless pieces of shit they make now. They cost less than 50% of a weeks pay.
Glad you got a fix going on the PCR50..
At the end of the day you will never see any repeatable success, or perfection in anyhing these Chinese junkwagons do, except, I find the M Audio KS88 to act as a hardware surface controller second to none. Many nice features like snapshot, mute all controllers when switching groups within a preset, etc...
Otherwise they would make a decent wrecking ball when dropped form a few hundred feet up in the air via a Helicopter.
When my last one starts acting up I am thinking of dropping it from the top of the St.Louis Arch which is 770 feet up, and sending the picture to M Audio.
These keyboards are so cheap, a case would cost more.
Thats why I like these worthless pieces of shit they make now. They cost less than 50% of a weeks pay.
Glad you got a fix going on the PCR50..
At the end of the day you will never see any repeatable success, or perfection in anyhing these Chinese junkwagons do, except, I find the M Audio KS88 to act as a hardware surface controller second to none. Many nice features like snapshot, mute all controllers when switching groups within a preset, etc...
Otherwise they would make a decent wrecking ball when dropped form a few hundred feet up in the air via a Helicopter.
When my last one starts acting up I am thinking of dropping it from the top of the St.Louis Arch which is 770 feet up, and sending the picture to M Audio.
Re: faulty keys
Does people there use to wear helmets?
Re: faulty keys
I should build a box myself. The tricky part is to replace function keys with buttons.
...Unless all the needed functions are accessible from software editor... I've to check that..
...Unless all the needed functions are accessible from software editor... I've to check that..
Re: faulty keys
contact strips are only available to service centers?
not here in the States...
i'm sure the internet can provide them.
not here in the States...
i'm sure the internet can provide them.
Re: faulty keys
I was not able to find those strips on web.
I sent an e-mail to Roland Italy support center at the end of April but got no reply, then I called Roland authorized service here in Sicily and they said to send them the keyboard. I asked for the price of the replacements, they said around 5 Euros for each strip plus work and shipment...
you said:
so...
I sent an e-mail to Roland Italy support center at the end of April but got no reply, then I called Roland authorized service here in Sicily and they said to send them the keyboard. I asked for the price of the replacements, they said around 5 Euros for each strip plus work and shipment...
you said:
those roland contact strips are pretty cheap, really. as long as you can take it apart and get it back together, it's not really a big deal. labor for a good technician is what makes the price too high to not just buy a different cheap keyboard.
so...