Graphics Tablet X-Y Controller

[David]

Has anyone here used a graphics tablet as an X-Y controller?

I'd be interested to know the accuracy and if they could be used with the fingers.
I'm hoping they're better than the little Korg things which I've read aren't too accurate.

I kinda figured it could be connected up using usb, midiox & midiyoke for controlling all the marvelous scope stuff and I'm sure something similar to Kaoss could be knocked up in modular

Could be fun as they seem quite cheap

Maplin

Tablet World

[braincell]

Yeah it's good. There are some free apps for it. You have to search this forum or google it.

[valis]

I've got 2 wacom tablets here, both are actually so old they're serial devices not USB (ArtZ II 9x12 & 12x12 from the 90's) but both still work fine so I've never had cause to replace them. I've used several different applications with them over the years too, but I've not ever gotten to the point where I feel they're a necessity as it's yet another device to remember to configure.

Assuming that you're on windows:
Tablet2midi was the best of the lot for me. Set your wacom to scale the screen to fit the surface so that it fills the full thing and you can print out maps that will correspond to input properly. I actually prefer aspect scaling (keeping the screen's aspect ratio) myself since my widescreen throws me off when using the 12x12 wacom without the aspect scaling, so I modify my tablet2midi 'map' (printed paper inserted into the wacom's underlay) in illustrator (print2pdf or adobe's pdf print driver etc) to fit. The only downside for me was being careful about when I land the pen to avoid parameter jumps while a voice was playing on something.

Wmidi was moderately interesting as an 'experimental' way of generating note sequences, but wasn't my preferred tool for the tablets.

Most of the OSX apps I've used over the years that are actual wacom/tablet midi apps (versus a generic input app to convert to midi) have disappeared, the only one I can still find is http://www.musicunfolding.com/MU_MIDI_Controller.html which is closest to wmidi.

PD, MaxMSP & Supercollider all have native support for tablets, and linux has a HUGE array of open source tools for grabbing tablet input and doing whatever you want with it. It's been 4-5 years since I fiddled with that in linux though so I'll refrain from posting as I'm sure the landscape has totally changed.

[David]

Cheers guys,

The jumping effect when you apply the pen puts me off a little.
I've since been looking at touch screens on ebay but they come in at about the same price if not more than a Kaos mini and although the touch screens on ebay measure up to 22" they look too delicate.

Thanks for your reviews, in the end I think for their price I will get a tablet

[valis]

I would only get the tablet if you can put it to graphical uses as well personally... Unless of course the idea *really* appeals to you. Perhaps I've just had mine for so long I don't find it novel anymore?

[braincell]

We all long for new interfaces but actually knobs, sliders and keyboard is pretty damn good. If you like to draw/paint, get a tablet.

[garyb]

woah!

such conservatism!

[David]

Idealy, I'd want to go for a CME Bitstream 3x or on smaller scale a Kaos mini.

I read reviews here that people would generally avoid CME devices
and elsewhere I have read the accuracy of the Kaos devices makes them a bit clunky

I'm just looking for an accurate resolution and reliable build quality for an X-Y controller and if possible have all the other midi controllers thrown in as an extra bonus, as in the 3x

Does anyone have any suggestions?

[braincell]

It's cumbersome to have to pick up the pen every time you want to use the XY control. I don't see why you can't do controllers as separate MIDI tracks.

I have heard KAOS pads are great.

[valis]

minikp has no midi out and rca/phono only audio connections (and not the most stellar AD/DA's to boot). Even the KP3 is more of a 'gimmick' than a dedicated studio kit imo.

Bitstream 3x & the CME keyboards that have touch automation (white ones) are decent for the money. I've wanted a bitstream myself since I haven't had the time to dig into ucaaps/midibox more.

Neutron's idea looks like a grand one though, especially if it has visual feedback (didn't look long enough to see, must run out the door now).

OH! If all you're wanting is x-y what I actually suggest is a joystick that can be set to be 'unsprung' so when u let go it holds its current position. There are quite a few midi2joy / hui related converters on the market that can turn that into usable midi input. In fact I have one attached to an sblive that lives in my Scope box (the sblive is kept for its gameport and the kx drivers). I use that a lot more than the tablet that's on that pc for midi, and the nice thing is that the options gamers would pass over are in some ways better for music (a realistic F-16 joystick isn't really what *I* want for generating some midi eh).

[braincell]

Here is what you should do:

Knob 1 = X
Knob 2 = Y

[David]

Ok, so I wasn't thinking big nor complex enough. Neutrons find is outstanding, way more fun than what I been thinking.

Valis, you're the second person to mention midibox, Foona's project build directed me to the ucapps site, it does look like something that would give so much control to Scope at not a bad price and the design become bespoke to your needs.

But this does look instantly much easier to actually acheive, what with the imminet releases on the horizon and finding time and all that.

Midibox will have to wait until winter.

Thanks a lot guys

[valis]

Incidentally I meant to mention something in my first post and I notice I forgot. The Bitstream 3x is distributed by CME but it's actually manufactured by Wave Idea...

[nightscope]

Nice thing about 3X is 2 x Midi Out + 1 USB Out. You can configure any control to go anywhere out of whatever. Midi's for Scope, say, USB for host. The X-Y controller is good and right next to the ribbon controller. X-Y stick is also another toggle switch when you push it in.

Korg PadKontrol has a nice X-Y pad and 2 configurable knobs at the top to do as braincell suggests. Another way to use brain's method is the Novation Nocturn which will work fine as bog standard CC controller without Automap when required. Plus you get automatic control over VST plugs. Novation Zero has a X-Y.



I have a little Wacom Bamboo. Very nice for general flitting around instead of mouse or trackball, never used it with MIDI and won't be. A bit of a bucking bronco. I think the more expensive ones are more accurate. I got a feeling the Trust cheapos might have better accuracy. I read that somewhere.

ns

[valis]

The more expensive wacom tablets are considerably more accurate than the cheap ones. In fact mine are ancient (then-expensive) serial models and even with those I have 0 complaints about the accuracy of the tracking.

The improvement in the modern ones over these is in the benefit of the usb interface: much higher polling rate (sampling rate) for smoother drawing at fast speeds (I can move fast enough to generate an n-sided polygon connecting sample points on mine) and the newer tablets increased the number of pressure levels from 128 to 1024.. The same applies to mice actually, with older mice I can move fast and get quite an obvious n-sided polygon connecting the sample points in paint/drawing applications, especially older mice. But the accuracy of the tracking is fine on the higher end Wacom units.