Headphones for Mixing...

[valis]

I've got several pairs of headphones lying about in varying condition, all of them still serviceable and familiar enough to me to know their limitations & strengths. So I don't really *need* another pair right now. But I've been mulling over getting a new pair for a year or so, for no real apparent reason. Here's the options I've 'found' during the course of this thread:

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(prices are USD market, feel free to provide your market references)
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Sennheiser HD 800 ($1399.99) - Open-backed and goes well with your italian sportscar. I drive a japanese sedan right now so...

Grado RS1 ($695) - The Grado RS1 page

Ultrasone PRO 900 ($549.00) - 40ohm & close-backed, detachable cord, collapsable but not the stupid swivel cup garbage (which I'd avoid) Haven't had any experience with Ultrasone but reviews are consistantly good online & in forums, could even be used Dj'ing/live performance perhaps.

Sennheiser HD 650 ($499.99) - 300ohm, Open-backed & lacks detacheable cables unfortunately. Possible applications for me would be 'mastering' or critical listening, sound design, mixing & casual listening...would have to make sure I have enough power on my current gear to drive them. If I go this way it's probably studio use only (I do know some people use them for Live PA & dj'ing with musicians plugs).

Beyerdynamic DT-48 (~$400 street) - which comes in both an A model and an E model. This design is apparently roughly 60 years old and hasn't changed much over the years, was highly recommended by a few users for its "reference" qualities (ie, mastering duties) but it comes in several impedences and when you look on the used market there's a dizzying variety of models that have come out over the years.

Ultrasone PROline 750 ($389.00) - Slightly more affordable than the PRO 900 above but largely the same specs (40ohm, close backed, detachable cables, could be used for livePA/dj'ing etc etc.)

Ultrasone PRO 2500 ($389.00) - Same as above (750) but with open bsack (no dj'ing/LivePA)

Sennheiser HD 600 ($389.99) - 300ohm, open backed, HAS detacheable cables unlike the newer HD 650. The Classic model but I'd be really tempted to just get the newer model above & eat the cost difference. Detachable cable is worth consideration but not a deal-maker alone.

Beyerdynamic DT 880 Pro ($329.99) - 250ohm, semi-open back, non-detachable cable. From reviews & forum comments online seem to be very accurate. Studio use only.

Beyerdynamic DT 990 PRO ($259.00) - 250ohm, open backed, non-detachable cable. Would fill the Audiophile casual listening role fine, not for tracking etc obviously.

AKG K271 MKII ($269.00) - 250ohm, close backed, detachable cable. I tend to follow Red Muze's advice here and prefer the 240's, as I already have the MDR-V900's for 'adequate' close backed headphones. Would be studio use only even though close-backed (too bulky for carrying around imo).

Sennheiser HD 380 Pro ($199.99) - 54ohm, Close-backed & detachable cable. Powerful & lightweight, usable for LivePA & Dj'ing as well as studio.

AKG K240MKII Semi Open Headphones ($199.00) - 55ohm, semi-open back, detachable cable. Would prefer these over the 271's above, though semi-open so not for tracking. Would be studio use only even though close-backed (too bulky for carrying around imo).

Berman Maestro 8.35 D Monitor ($200/149,00€) - (from German Maestro--I recall this company from when they were known as M.B. Quart, no idea how that translates to their headphones)

Sennheiser HD 280 Pro ($119.99) - 64ohm, Close-backed & non-detachable cable. Powerful & lightweight, usable for LivePA & Dj'ing as well as studio.

[ChampionSound]

I hear a lot of good stories about the AKG K701 lately, about its fidelity and analytical sound.
I haven't tested it myself though.

[garyb]

the k240 is the standard of studio phones. i don't know about the current mkII crop, but the originals were made to last many years in the studio environment and be reasonably accurate. i would mix on phones myself, but i might check the mix on phones. the k240 is really for tracking anyway.

the AT phones in general are very good, but they are more "consumer" in build, or at least that's how it was the last time i was purchasing phones. the ATs should be reasonably good as well.

[Shroomz~>]

You might not have thought of them, but I can't speak highly enough of Ultrasone headphones Valis. We've got a couple of pairs of their older HFI-2000 model which were over £250 each when new & they're really really nice cans. Semi open-back & seriously comfortable to wear. Excellent sounding with a great frequency response as well. The reason I mention them is that if these things are anything to go by, then Ultrasone's newest range of pro headphones might well be worth checking out. It looks like they've retained the quality & comfort of the older model we have here. They still come with velvet earpads (like ours) for comfort & even ship with a spare set. They also have what they call a metal bufferboard to reduce the amount of electromagnetic emissions produced by the headphones (they claim 98% less than standard heaphones). As well as that, the cable is detachable & they come with a spare. I've looked at them in online shops & thought about getting a set, but haven't done any research into them or looked for reviews yet, which you'll want to do If you're spending some serious cash on headphones.

[garyb]

semi open would be better for mixing. the k240 is closed so that leakage will be minimal during tracking.

[ReD_MuZe]

i love the 240
better than the 270 imho
they are real survivors too.
they take a beating...

soundwise i would prefer the hifi sony headphones - as those realy sound wicked.
if you need rock solid bass, i would go senheiser
but for me - 240 wins.

[Neutron]

i was thinking of getting some K240s but there are 55 ohm and 600 ohm versions.
i would normally go for the 55 ohm version just because of my equipment, but is there an audible difference between them? i can always make something more optimized for 600 ohm

[Fluxpod]

I use Sennheiser HD 580 Precision,now Hd600.I can recommend em,they are light and sound great.Also nice for mixing are Beyerdynamik 990.
I wouldt use anything else for mixing.

[erminardi]

GRADO headphones are IMO the best in the merket for monitoring.
Pay attention: headphones are good as a second listening, you need also a pair of monitor as main reference to make a right mix/master!!! (and a calibrate enviroment around...)

[astroman]

the AKG 701 has a very open soundstage - the opposite of the 240 in that context.
It's the most convenient thing if you have to have it on for long periods.
Amazing detail and precision, but never nervous and no fatigue at all.
A good compromise between hifi and analytics - imho capable as a reference if you have to mix in an 'untuned' environment.

cheers, Tom

[valis]

Good input from everyone, and new options to consider. Appreciate the responses so far.

I'm not planning on using the headphones for my primary mixing reference, and I do happen to have 2 sets of studio monitors: nothing amazing, HR824 & Alesis Monitor1's as secondary, Akai 3-way 'hi-fi' speakers from the 80's and a set of tiny 4" Rolands for my "boombox"-esque monitoring. My room is decent size, non-square and as tamed as I care to make it without going to great expense (though not so foamed up as to sound muffled in the top end and 'boomy' at bottom).

When I do use headphones during mixing specifically it's often for more clinical purposes than it is 'soundstage' & enjoyment, so hopefully any new (pricier) cans I get will enable me to hone in on clicks, pops, buzzes and the like even better (accuracy). At the same time having a pair I could use for extended enjoyable listening wouldn't be horrible either. I don't need close-backed for sound isolation either, when that's a necessity any of the cans I currently have will work (I have a pair of Sonys for anyone that happens to want to put up with me for recording purposes).

Just wanted to respond before the thread got too long, I'll have a look over the options listed here later today/tomorrow when I've got some time to do research. My wife liked the idea of getting a $200-400 set of headphones as my gift as I told her that I've been considering it but haven't made the purchase myself since it isn't really a 'need' as much as a 'want'. Ie, something I haven't been willing to buy for myself...

[erminardi]

http://www.goodcans.com/HeadphoneReview ... ations.htm

Grado are not so famous, (knows only in hi-fi enviroment), not so beauty (however very good build, extremely light & wearable, and rock solid), but really excellent and first-quality choice respect the other brands!
And the price/quality could be a very surpise...
Look also at the second hand market.

[siriusbliss]

I hear a lot of good stories about the AKG K701 lately, about its fidelity and analytical sound.
I haven't tested it myself though.

+1 for the AKG K701.
I use it as an optional mixing tool to do a/b comparision with regular monitors.

Greg

[Throttler]

k271 here, very happy, still not close to mixing with speakers.

[MCCY]

I also use the K240 in contrast to "Quart Phone 400" & "Quart Phone 240" and a good old Sony MDR-CD480. I like the k240 less then the others, but I think with headphones it's really important to switch while mixing. They all sound completely different and compromising is the keyword for me.

[capacitor]

Erminardi, do you consider the Grados to be neutral (i.e. not full of color)?

[tgstgs]

check the k271 switch off automatic;
essential when recording with mics for me;

good vibes

[helldriver]

I use a Sennheiser HD600, one of the best headphones for listening and mixing. Even Andy Jackson (Producer of David Gilmour´s On An Island) is using a HD600.

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul06/a ... ackson.htm

[krizrox]

Be careful, the K240's are semi-open which means they will leak sound into the microphones during tracking. I have a few pair of them here myself but clients rarely use them for tracking. But they are built like tanks and I like them for mixing purposes. My only real complaints about them have nothing to do with sound quality...

1) service - AKG isn't the easiest company to deal with when it comes to replacement parts. Last year I had to order some replacement ear pads and it took like 3 months to get them.

2) Speaking of those ear pads, whatever it is they make them out of (vinyl or simul-leather) that stuff doesn't wear well. It might have something to do with hair chemicals but I find those pads deteriorate pretty fast. Much faster than other brands I have here. Also the headband assembly has a habit of cracking right in the middle. It's a fairly thin piece of vinyl (or simul-leather or whatever it's made of).

Aside from those few things you can pretty much whip them around the room without worry. They have a nice clean flat sound which makes them great for mixing (I think). Too many moving parts on the AT's. I tend to avoid phones with rotating/collapsing ear cups as they will inevitably break at those junctions.

[valis]

Clean flat sound is actually what I'm after, which is why open-back are on the list. I have several options I'm familiar enough with to use during tracking, I want something less boxy and more 'accurate' to use when mixing so I can a/b against monitors with more confidence.

I find headphones reveal flaws (noise & plosives) much more readily than monitors due, since the 'damping' effects are less with the room removed & smaller drivers. There are also interesting comparisons that can be made to monitors when making mixing decisions, at least in my experience. For instance my monitors tend to 'glue' things together a lot more, and give a better image of what the soundstage will be like in most playback situations. But headphones will reveal something that's poking out of the mix quite quickly (depending on the flaws of the headphone) as well as show soundstage decisions that are too extreme.

I agree completely about swiveling ear cups & other gimmicky headphone builds. I've watched many break for friends over the years as a DJ, and have no desire to repeat that process myself on the road or in the studio.

Also noted about the AKG parts & materials, thanks. The K240's are still at the top of my list, but I haven't had much time to deal with research this week. At the pace I'm going I probably won't complete this process for a few weeks yet (long after the date in question) but I'll try to keep up with this thread as necessary...