VSTi automation via external MIDI controller in SL2?

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 3:33 am

Does anybody know whether it's possible to automate VSTi instruments' parameters by using an external MIDI hardware controller in CUbase SL2?

As far as I have been able to work out, this is possible in SL3 but in SL2 one can only externally control 'Cubase' objects like the mixer and audio channel settings.

I don't really want to have to upgrade if I can help it, but this feature would be very useful for me to have.

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 5:41 am

AFAIK, the only differences between SL2 & SX2 are that SL doesn't have the surround mixing or score editing. If you've got a VST effect or VSTi loaded In SL2 you should (afaik) be able to get midi control of it by setting up a new midi track, setting the correct midi input for the new track to get an input from your external controller via scope or direct from a midi interface, then set the midi output of the new track to the VST or VSTi you're trying to control (it will show up in the list of midi destinations if it's capable of midi automation)

We run SX2, so there's an element of guess work about SL in what I've written here.

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 5:57 am

That's just like setting up a normal MIDI track to control a VSTi though, e.g. to record ordinary note performance.

I understand that, but how do I know which MIDI messages affect which VSTi automation parameters? As far as I understand it, one has to set-up a 'Generic MIDI Controller' (as opposed to one which Cubase already supports) and then use that.

I can see from the manual how to do this to control e.g. the Cubase mixer or Audio Channels, but I can't see how to connect a specific MIDI CC through to an automatable VSTi parameter (e.g. 'OSC 2 Fine Tune' or 'OSC 3 LFO pwm') ?

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 6:29 am

Which external midi controller do you have & what VSTi is this you'd like to control? Both of these things make a difference, as VSTis can have automation & learn functions implemeted in different ways.

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 6:48 am

Shroomz wrote:Which external midi controller do you have & what VSTi is this you'd like to control? Both of these things make a difference, as VSTis can have automation & learn functions implemeted in different ways.

My external controller is the doepfer pocket controller.

As for which VSTi, 'any VSTi'

Some VSTis do have quite well thought out MIDI assignment for their parameters (e.g. Ravity S is a good example of this).

I was using IBlit yesterday when I found myself trying to work this out, but the Cubase manual only indicated two methods for controlling the automation parameters as far as I could see:

1. Draw/edit directly in the automation track(s)
2. Enable 'Write Automation' and control the VSTi's parameters directly through its UI.

I've just downloaded the latest version of iblit which has MIDI Learn and MIDI Automation implemented apparently, so I'll try that out this evening.

I think that the question I'm trying to answer is, to control a VSTi's parameters by MIDI in Cubase SL2, does one have to use MIDI CC messages directed straight to the VSTi, or can one map MIDI messages to VST Automation parameters? I'd have thought that the first would be VSTi-specific and the latter Cubase-specific behaviour.

This is what happens when you don't use your DAW for over a year...you forget how everything works!

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:15 am

pffff, over 4 hours of telewest broadband downtime last night.

Anyway, back to your topic!!

I'm quite sure that it almost completely depends on the VSTi's automation implementation. Some don't have controller assignments built in & can only be automated internally by tweeking the VTSi's interface. Some have CCs properly mapped to the automation system. Many now have learn functions too, so something like LoungeLizard comes with CCs pre-mapped to the automation system, all of which can be changed using the learn midi link function when right-clicking on a parameter.

So, yes you should send CC messages straight to the VSTi via a dedicated midi track if they are pre-mapped or can be mapped by you. You can map MIDI CC messages to VST Automation parameters on any VST or VSTi which has a learn function or another method of parameter mapping built in. Midi control of VSTfx & VSTi's should work perfectly well in SL.

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:59 am

Cheers for that, it's helped clarifiy things nicely

From the SL3 blurb, it looks like Steinberg have implemented some kind of MIDI-to-VST Automation mapping functionality in that version.

I'm trying to find out from Steinberg whether it's still possible to upgrade from SL2 to SL3. From their website, upgrades from SL2 or SL3 to Cubase 4 are possible but that is quite an expensive path to take (AKA very expensive!).

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 3:44 am

You can upgrade from SL2 to Cubase Studio 4 for 149euro, but I'm not entirely sure if it would be worth your while or not, because the upgrade from SL2 & SL3 to the full version 4 costs the same as it does from Studio 4!! Bit strange that one.

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 3:50 am

Aye, just noticed that one.

In UKP it's £99.99 to go from SL -> Cubase Studio but an incredible £349.99 to go up to Cubase 4 (from pretty much anything) !

Looks like Studio 4 is the next upgrade step for me then, if I decide to go for it.

djmicron · Post by **djmicron** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 5:41 am

an easy way to remote control a vst plugins that has not implementation for midi learn or midi cc assignments, is to open the plugin form vst chainer and all parameters can be assigned from the midi learn functionality of chainer.

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:26 am

Thanks for the tip. Are you referring to this:

http://www.xlutop.com/html/chainer.html

?

djmicron · Post by **djmicron** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:45 am

Yes, sorry i did forget to submit a link of it....

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 7:47 am

Ah!! vst chainer. Nice one micron!