Routing all tracks to same output...

Chisel · Post by **Chisel** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 8:27 pm

I've seen XTC projects here that use switch it or other XTC-compatible mini-mixers to route individual audio tracks from the sequencer into Scope. I discovered that it's possible to route all of the sequencer tracks to a single output which then gets routed back into the sequencer as one mixdown track. Am I still summing in Creamware by using this method? I don't see why not, since I'm not using the sequencer's bussing to route all the tracks to a mixdown track. I'm actually sending them all into Scope and then back to the sequencer. Here's a screenshot of my XTCProject. I use 1/2 as my mixdown channels. 3/4 - 9/10 are for bouncing submixes. The S/PDIF, ADAT, and Analog sources are my outboard gear (The MPC feeds into the first four ADATs and the two S/PDIF, which is why the routing is a little twisted). ADAT dest 5/6 if for my studio monitors. ADAT 7/8 is for my headphones. Analog Dest is for an extra set of speakers with a subwoofer.

Any comments?

Thanks,
Chisel

marcuspocus · Post by **marcuspocus** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 11:18 pm

you're actually summing in your VST host like this...

Not necessarily a bad thing, this simplify a bit the work flow, and this way, you can have a single sfp project for almost any needs.

Chisel · Post by **Chisel** » Wed Apr 26, 2006 7:03 am

On 2006-04-26 00:18, marcuspocus wrote:
you're actually summing in your VST host like this...

That's what I was afraid of. I didn't think it sounded as pristine as when I sum in Scope. So, I guess I'll have to route all tracks to separate outputs in order to sum in Scope. I thought I found a shorcut by doing it this way, but the more I examined the routing, the more I realized that I was bypassing Scope this way. Oh well, back to the drawing board.

So, if the direct-routing from ASIO source to ASIO dest bypasses Scope, then why use it? Why not just create the submix in the Sequencer? I may setup a few switch it modules for submix purposes. We'll see.

Thanks,
Chisel

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Chisel on 2006-04-26 17:23 ]</font>

Chisel · Post by **Chisel** » Wed Apr 26, 2006 10:32 pm

Okay, I made some changes tonight. ASIO Source 1/2 goes to the monitors. All other ASIO Source channels are mixed and output to ASIO Dest 1/2. Now I'm summing in Scope, right? I decided not to bother with the submixes. I'll just route them internally in Live. Only the sub-mixed track will be routed into Scope along with the other stand-alone tracks.

Comments?

Thanks,
Chisel

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 4:36 am

In that specific project you will only sum ASIO source 2L to 17R in Scope.
But I don't understand why you are not monitoring from the "MIX 2 S" outputs. After all, you want to hear what it sounds like while being summed, no?
Unless source 1/2 is some pre-listen output for headphones, which Live supports. But in your projhect, there is no way to monitor the summed mix unless you plan on input-monitoring ASIO dest 1/2 in Live.

Chisel · Post by **Chisel** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:31 am

On 2006-04-27 05:36, voidar wrote:
But in your projhect, there is no way to monitor the summed mix unless you plan on input-monitoring ASIO dest 1/2 in Live.

Exactly. I originally had the mix going straight to the monitors, but then I wouldn't be able to hear anything that is applied *after* that stage. With the routing above, I only hear what I send to Ext. Out 1/2 in Live. This way, I can add an Optimaster to the track that is feeding the Mix and listen to the Optimaster-effected track in Live -- where as before, I could only hear the mix *before* the Optimaster. So this setup actually gives me a master insert bus in Live. Does that make sense? Is there a better way to do this?

Thanks,
Chisel

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:00 am

I see. Not a bad solution. I guess it's a good way to have an effected monitor environment.

However, I usally mixdown first before poping out the mastering tools (if ever).

You could insert an optimaster in the project, but it would be a bitch to control - though possible via midi - I believe.

Chisel · Post by **Chisel** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:29 am

On 2006-04-27 11:00, voidar wrote:
You could insert an optimaster in the project, but it would be a bitch to control - though possible via midi - I believe.

I thought of that also, but is it possible to see the devices that are in the project? I don't know how to do this, so I opted for the routing scheme instead.

One thing I noticed about using XTC mode and summing in Scope is that when I apply a spectrum analyzer (i.e. Inspector) to the mixed track, it never clips -- no matter how loud the signal is. Kinda strange..

Peace /
Chisel

Bifop · Post by **Bifop** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 3:18 pm

On 2006-04-27 11:29, Chisel wrote:

I thought of that also, but is it possible to see the devices that are in the project? I don't know how to do this, so I opted for the routing scheme instead.

Chisel, the easiest way I found, is to insert a MD8 (or MD4) module with a multiFx S inserted in each row you'll want multiple plugins option.

The same chain applied into the direct monitoring signal path followed by a SF mix 2 (SpaceF) mixer and you'll have your XTC project with direct monitoring and insertable FX + mixer.

All the Scope plugins load that way and are editable and visible...

The MD8 is stereo. The MD4 is mono.

Bifop

Chisel · Post by **Chisel** » Fri Apr 28, 2006 8:32 pm

I found MD4, MD4 S, and MD16 modules. I can't find the MultiFX modules. The closest I have is the AuxRack, but I don't know if that works in XTC mode. I'm still confused how you would route these devices and see them in the VST host. Can you show me a screenshot of this setup and/or give me a more detailed explanation. Thanks!

Peace /
Chisel

Bifop · Post by **Bifop** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 7:19 am

Ok Chisel, here is a picture of a setup with an md8 inserted beetween two asio source dest.
http://djomusic.free.fr//Workshop/Misc/ ... 20type.bmp

Here is a simpler one just for inserting effects + a mixer into the direct monitoring chain.
http://djomusic.free.fr//Workshop/Misc/ ... ns+mix.JPG

Here is a zip file with all the free devices you need for this setup (mix2S, md8, Md16, MD4&S, SF mix2, MultifX S).
http://djomusic.free.fr//Workshop/Misc/ ... mixers.zip

Important tips !
When saving you xtcproject.pro, be sure that the devices are visible. That's the way you'll get them to appear when in your vst host.
The md devices can be midified to appear on call (assign a controller to the close button).

I've assigned a midi channel to the mixer as well so I'm able to control my direct monitor from the Houston ctrler.

With nothing inserted in the MD's, no sound will pass through so you need a multifx permanently inserted or a plugin.

Enjoy!
Bifop

Chisel · Post by **Chisel** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 9:21 pm

Hi Bifop,

Thanks for the files and explanation! I really appreciate your help. I see a few problems with your setup in my environment:

1) I need to create two audio tracks for each track I want to add MultiFX to (one track to send to Scope and one track to bring it back to Live)

2) The tracks that are routed through the MD module and back into Live aren't summed in Scope, right?

Thanks for the tip on having the modules visible in the routing window. I would've never figured that out.

Peace /
Chisel

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 8:28 am

Thanks Befop! I didn't know of this feature

.