Hello!
I have two questions about how to use Scope for live sessions remotely.
I have Scope 4.0 (I just bougth 4.5, but I haven't installed it yet).
The computer is a well working Dell Optiplex with XP Pro.
I also have a WLAN card in this computer.
Issue 1 is that when I use my Scope computer for live sessions with synths, I would like to have the ability to control it from a laptop at stage using WLAN. Am I able to use Remote Desktop or NetOp for this purpose? I don't want to bring my Scope computer at stage, nor bring a screen to my gigs. It's enough with the tower box and the laptop.
My issue 2 is not far from my first: If I use Scope for live mixing, is it possible to use more than one laptops to stear the Scope mixer. I am using STM24/48, and would maybe like to have one house mixing place and one stage mixing place. If this is possible, am I able to control different parts of the mixer on each laptops?
I have not tested any of these configurations. I thought I first should ask you if you think it's possible.
See my <a href='http://www.mikla.nu/Live_Session_Remote.pdf'>PDF</a> for a picture of what I mean.
Best Regards
/Magnus
Remotely manage Scope
not using remote desktop myself, i probably shouldn't hazard a guess, but i'll guess anyway. i guess that'd work. afai understand it, screen redraws may be just a tad slow...also, i don't think you can choose which device each laptop controls. i would think each laptop would have access to the entire scope environment. there is minor chance of havoc between stage and foh crews...
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2006-01-03 01:10 ]</font>
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2006-01-03 01:10 ]</font>
Hi BlombergM, In these weeks I'm searching infos to build a kind of "musical server" to pilot my pulsar in my studio using a pc in my home and then, if it works, using the pc of a couple of my friends at the same time, so ours problems seems very similar, what a coincidence!
That's good because we can share ours infos.
Last week I've done a test wich was partially succesfull.
I've used "TightVNC" http://www.tightvnc.com/ as virtual desktop and "unreal media server"
http://www.umediaserver.net/
as audio server (VNC doesn't send audio).
It was quite hard to configure, but finally it works. The cons I've noticed were
-latency (about 500ms) wich makes the mixing possible but not the playing live or recording.
-low fidelity of the audio server (mp3 56k). With the commercial version of the program you can reach 128k wich was too low to make any nice mixing in my opinion.
-low refresh rate of the windows.
I've done this test between my laptop and a friend's laptop so the pulsar wasn't involved . I've used the wlan.
Previously I've tried the winamp audio server called "shoutcast" but due the buffersize the latency was up to 10 seconds, wich was un-aceptable for any audio editing use.
That's good because we can share ours infos.
Last week I've done a test wich was partially succesfull.
I've used "TightVNC" http://www.tightvnc.com/ as virtual desktop and "unreal media server"
http://www.umediaserver.net/
as audio server (VNC doesn't send audio).
It was quite hard to configure, but finally it works. The cons I've noticed were
-latency (about 500ms) wich makes the mixing possible but not the playing live or recording.
-low fidelity of the audio server (mp3 56k). With the commercial version of the program you can reach 128k wich was too low to make any nice mixing in my opinion.
-low refresh rate of the windows.
I've done this test between my laptop and a friend's laptop so the pulsar wasn't involved . I've used the wlan.
Previously I've tried the winamp audio server called "shoutcast" but due the buffersize the latency was up to 10 seconds, wich was un-aceptable for any audio editing use.
Welcome to the dawning of a new empire
dunno the XP remote console, but I always found <a href=http://www.netopia.com/software/product ... imbuktu</a> a solid and easy to install solution.
I've even controlled a Scope system from an old Powermax 8100 (80MHZ, pre PCI)
it's quite expensive, but you may not need the latest version - the older ones are frequently on eBay for a few bucks.
Check the demo and decide if it's worth considering.
cheers, Tom
I've even controlled a Scope system from an old Powermax 8100 (80MHZ, pre PCI)
it's quite expensive, but you may not need the latest version - the older ones are frequently on eBay for a few bucks.
Check the demo and decide if it's worth considering.
cheers, Tom
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ScofieldKid
- Posts: 307
- Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2003 4:00 pm
- Location: Oregon
- Contact:
Just thinking about this topic in general and trying some things. Not sure if the Remote Desktop driver would work which Scope. If it did, that would be the simple way, for Windows XP -> Windows XP sound.
Looked at some other generic possibilities. Microsoft has a free "Windows Media Encoder" utility. It's kind of ugly but it can get a stream going out. So it worked for my generic test streaming from Foobar2000.
Second attempt was something I'm more familiar with, which is SHOUTcast. You download the Windows32 SHOUTcast server. Then this is the fun part, you use the Winamp SHOUTcast DSP plugin and set the input to "Soundcard Input". Launch Foobar2000 and it is streaming away.
I actually did my testing of this on a Linux box as the client. So ultimately you could even do %rdesktop on the Linux side and use the -r sound:remote option, and control the video remotely with that, and do the audio with MPlayer or VLC.
Other idea I had on this was FXTeleport. I'm guessing on this one, but if you had a VSTplugin vstihost and you could FXTeleport to the other side, you might be able to get a remote->local audio stream. I don't really have a way to test that, but it seems like in some cases this might produce a pretty straightforward connection.
Looked at some other generic possibilities. Microsoft has a free "Windows Media Encoder" utility. It's kind of ugly but it can get a stream going out. So it worked for my generic test streaming from Foobar2000.
Second attempt was something I'm more familiar with, which is SHOUTcast. You download the Windows32 SHOUTcast server. Then this is the fun part, you use the Winamp SHOUTcast DSP plugin and set the input to "Soundcard Input". Launch Foobar2000 and it is streaming away.
I actually did my testing of this on a Linux box as the client. So ultimately you could even do %rdesktop on the Linux side and use the -r sound:remote option, and control the video remotely with that, and do the audio with MPlayer or VLC.
Other idea I had on this was FXTeleport. I'm guessing on this one, but if you had a VSTplugin vstihost and you could FXTeleport to the other side, you might be able to get a remote->local audio stream. I don't really have a way to test that, but it seems like in some cases this might produce a pretty straightforward connection.
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ScofieldKid
- Posts: 307
- Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2003 4:00 pm
- Location: Oregon
- Contact:
Oh, yeah. It's pretty bad. I was really thinking of a different problem, like if you have a Scope system at home and you need to check something out while you are at work... More to the original question, there is also this thing: a virtual desktop that works over the network. They say you could do a total of 4 machines like this. I think it did get some favorable reviews: http://www.maxivista.com/multi_monitor.htm
NOTE: It looks like the R2D2-Software.com mentioned on another thread is feature identical with this. I would have to guess that it is the same product. Just another FYI. Both only lets you remote control from the master pc.
Ah... one more diversion. Just found this Synergy thing. So the above is "take one pc and fan out the displays on my other desktop machines." This one is: "take one keyboard and mouse and fan it out to my other machines." Could save on some desktop clutter if you want to either get rid of a KVM, or lose some of the keyboards and mice.
http://synergy2.sourceforge.net/
Remote Desktop or any of the variants of VNC might be just as good for your case. Sorry for the off topic stuff.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ScofieldKid on 2006-01-14 18:18 ]</font>
NOTE: It looks like the R2D2-Software.com mentioned on another thread is feature identical with this. I would have to guess that it is the same product. Just another FYI. Both only lets you remote control from the master pc.
Ah... one more diversion. Just found this Synergy thing. So the above is "take one pc and fan out the displays on my other desktop machines." This one is: "take one keyboard and mouse and fan it out to my other machines." Could save on some desktop clutter if you want to either get rid of a KVM, or lose some of the keyboards and mice.
http://synergy2.sourceforge.net/
Remote Desktop or any of the variants of VNC might be just as good for your case. Sorry for the off topic stuff.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ScofieldKid on 2006-01-14 18:18 ]</font>
I have used remote desktop from a laptop via wireless to control my desktop and it works well even with wireless conection just make sure you enable leave sound on computer option
http://www.prorec.com/prorec/articles.n ... AA000EC101
http://www.prorec.com/prorec/articles.n ... AA000EC101
Hi folks!
First, I have to say I'm sorry for not getting back when I told you I would.
I have now run a gig using Hammond B-2003 with remote desktop via WLAN. It rocks!!! I tried Timbuktu but it was not giving me better performance, it costs money (160$) and is not as simple as Remote Desktop. When it stopped working, but I believe I did something wrong.
I did get some problems though: With XP Pro I couldn't logon to the DAW without logging of the local session at DAW. Fortunately, this is done automatically when using administrator account. I don't now but with Windows Server 2003, you could have several sessions running at the same time. But since I haven't tried this at my DAW I don't know how Scope reacts if I have several sessions running.
Another problem was the rendering with remote desktop. When using my midi keyboard as the remote control, for example for changing patches in B-2003, it is really not updating the screen every time. Sometimes it doesn't understand that the GUI has been changed, so no update is sent from DAW to the notebook. If I move the B-2003 window the screen will be updated directly. Tried some different settings in the notebook remote desktop experience settings, without any success. I think this worked a little better with Timbuktu. I believe Scope uses some special code to update the B-2003 GUI, that doesn't seem to be covered by the remote desktop service.
I haven't tried the several sessions yet, though I didn't get this to work with XPPro. I don't know if I will, but if I do, I will response to the Planet-Z.
Thanks for your answers.
Regards Magnus
First, I have to say I'm sorry for not getting back when I told you I would.
I have now run a gig using Hammond B-2003 with remote desktop via WLAN. It rocks!!! I tried Timbuktu but it was not giving me better performance, it costs money (160$) and is not as simple as Remote Desktop. When it stopped working, but I believe I did something wrong.
I did get some problems though: With XP Pro I couldn't logon to the DAW without logging of the local session at DAW. Fortunately, this is done automatically when using administrator account. I don't now but with Windows Server 2003, you could have several sessions running at the same time. But since I haven't tried this at my DAW I don't know how Scope reacts if I have several sessions running.
Another problem was the rendering with remote desktop. When using my midi keyboard as the remote control, for example for changing patches in B-2003, it is really not updating the screen every time. Sometimes it doesn't understand that the GUI has been changed, so no update is sent from DAW to the notebook. If I move the B-2003 window the screen will be updated directly. Tried some different settings in the notebook remote desktop experience settings, without any success. I think this worked a little better with Timbuktu. I believe Scope uses some special code to update the B-2003 GUI, that doesn't seem to be covered by the remote desktop service.
I haven't tried the several sessions yet, though I didn't get this to work with XPPro. I don't know if I will, but if I do, I will response to the Planet-Z.
Thanks for your answers.
Regards Magnus