Problem in SF saving high quality???

___crisis___1 · Post by **___crisis___1** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 11:04 pm

okay, for some reason... when i save a file in sound forge, or any program for that matter... even SX, that is above 44.1 16-bit in wav format it won't play in any media player!? if i open it in SF, or SX it plays fine... but it won't play in a media player? as soon as i save it at 44.1 and 16bit it plays fine? and i can save it as mp3 at 320 and it plays fine.

any ideas? and worse case scenario i can't fix it... is it better to save as wav at 44.1 and 16bit then mp3 @ 320?

alfonso · Post by **alfonso** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 11:14 pm

Media player can't play higher bit depths than 16 bits.
You could try Foobar player for that.

http://www.foobar2000.org/

___crisis___1 · Post by **___crisis___1** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 12:19 am

really... that sucks. so, i use a product called scratch live, that allowa me to manipulate audio from my pc with a controller record... if i load it in there and it doesn't play, it's because it can't handle that high of quality audio files?

do you really lose that much quality from 44.1 and 16 bit to 96 and 24 bit? should i be worried about this?

alfonso · Post by **alfonso** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 12:26 am

On 2005-08-15 01:19, ___crisis___1 wrote:
really... that sucks. so, i use a product called scratch live, that allowa me to manipulate audio from my pc with a controller record... if i load it in there and it doesn't play, it's because it can't handle that high of quality audio files?

do you really lose that much quality from 44.1 and 16 bit to 96 and 24 bit? should i be worried about this?

You should'nt.

If you dither your music down to 16 bits after you've done all the sound edits and processings you're ok.

For the frequency I don't know what's the limit of that app, but I never use more than 44.1 even if I could and I'm fine with that.

Stige · Post by **Stige** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 6:06 am

Not sure if this is the difference, but:

In my internet system I have media player 9, and all files (16, 24, 32, 32-float) plays fine.
Only aiff are not valid

..surprise

In my music system I have media player 8, and only 16 bit files are playable

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Stige on 2005-08-15 07:08 ]</font>

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 6:23 am

On 2005-08-15 01:19, ___crisis___1 wrote:
...do you really lose that much quality from 44.1 and 16 bit to 96 and 24 bit? should i be worried about this?

I agree with Alfonso - no need to worry

and you will not even be able to hear a quality difference between a perfectly levelled 16 bit and a 24 bit tone.

so a well recorded instrument makes no difference at all, but the higher dynamic range of 24 bit gives a 'usable' signal even if the original record lacks a significant amount of loudness (for whatever reasons).

in this context 24 bit is much more convenient - if it 'sounds' more precise then due to a different converter (or it's setup) but not due to an increased bit depth.

But mp3 IS a truely bad choice for archive purpose imho, at least if it's the only copy.
The algorithm DOES filter the signal, hence it changes the master - it doesn't matter if your ears can detect this or not.
There is content REMOVED from the file and nothing will ever bring it back.

So it may not make a difference on a consumer CD player, but what if you want to process the content with (say) a convolution algorithm later ?
Math (or a physical room) don't have the imperfection of our hearing system and so the mp3 source is likely to produce a different output than an uncompressed file.
Go figure yourself...

cheers, tom

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: astroman on 2005-08-15 07:24 ]</font>

___crisis___1 · Post by **___crisis___1** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 12:31 pm

i have 9.0... so i don't think that is it...

so, it would be best to record in 24 bit, and then dither to 16 bit?

valis · Post by **valis** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 5:55 pm

What driver are you using as your primary (default) MME/Directsound driver? Is it one of the Creamware WAV drivers (and did you insure it was the 24bit one) or is it onboard sound/sblive etc?

___crisis___1 · Post by **___crisis___1** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 9:10 pm

i am using a 24bit wave module. in sfp.

valis · Post by **valis** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 10:12 pm

Well winamp, foobar2000 and mediaplayer 9/10 all handle 24bit files here just fine. In fact I discovered the other day that winamp will even handle certain 32bit formats without any problem depending on your soundcard (foobar2000 does too but I would have expected that).

___crisis___1 · Post by **___crisis___1** » Tue Aug 16, 2005 12:55 pm

should i contact the makers of my scratch live product, to ask whether it will handle higher quality files? or is this a problem with my system? i have media player 9... and it won't play anything above 16...

maybe it's time for a reload of windows?

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:09 pm

there is no 'higher' quality in playback those files, they are just more convenient to work with.
compare the improved resolution (of 24 bits) to the regular jitter rate of your system.
You'll find out that the latter effect is much more significant - that simple

of course a Scope's Analog Devices 24bit output converter 'sounds' better than an onboard AC97, which it does on all resolutions - simply because it's the better device.
but those players should indeed be able to scale the bits automatically...

no need to worry, Tom