Rack-mounted mic preamps with phantom power.

takieda · Post by **takieda** » Sat Jul 23, 2005 1:46 pm

Just like it says, that's what I need. We have 2 condenser mics which require phantom power, and the A16 Ultra doesn't provide this. We also need it to be run through a preamp (which usually has phantom power anyway). We will most likely have a third mic, and may even have a fourth, but beyond that it's not really plausible. So we do need at least 4, but no real need for more.

What are some of the better systems out there that provide this? I saw a Rolls unit that does six but it's only phantom power, and I saw an SM Pro Audio unit that has 8 and is a preamp, but I have no clue as to the quality of any of these units.

One point of note is my father doesn't care for ART for one reason or another and is basically refusing to buy those products unless you can really sell me on the idea and I can do the same to him.

Thanks for any help that can be given,
-Tak

at0m · Post by **at0m** » Sat Jul 23, 2005 2:18 pm

Top quality, but takes some skills:
http://1176neve.tripod.com/id15.html .

You'll be set cheaper and better than my setup with the single channel of Forcusrite Trackmaster. The inputs of the laptop's card provide +48V, balanced inputs and pre-amps too, for recording outdoors - usually 1 mic/input is all I use.

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Sat Jul 23, 2005 2:34 pm

i'm thinking of getting one of the Toft range, the ATC-2 does the lot, pre,comp,EQ, or the smaller AFC-2 just EQ and pre. Nice quality at a reasonable price from the man who built the famous Trident consoles. Good review from SOS here.

Mr A

[ This Message was edited by: Mr Arkadin on 2005-07-24 05:45 ]

Post by **garyb** » Sat Jul 23, 2005 6:12 pm

for cheap, one of the best pres is this:
http://www.fmraudio.com/RNP8380.htm

this is high quality pro gear for a consumer grade price.

takieda · Post by **takieda** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:09 am

Thanks for the quick response to everyone..

at0m: That unit definitely looks like it would do the job, but unfortunately, I don't have the skills or the time for making one of those. I guess that's why purchasing professional gear is so expensive.

Mr Arkadin: Both of those only support 2 mics, and while we only have two mics now, we may get up to two more, so we'd probably need to get two of either. However, considering all audio would be coming directly from the mics through the preamp and into an A-16 Ultra where all audio is then processed by the Scope with god knows how many different virtual EQs and the like, is there any benefit to actually having EQ's physically there? (especially take into consideration that the entire rack is under tempered glass because it's on a boat that tends to move a lot and requires the protection - so the rack is only accessible when the door is open, and it can't remain open). I will be looking for other products by them however, as you have recommended them.
*edit* okay, I've checked their product line and they have nothing beyond two line systems - I would definitely need to purchase two of either unit.

garyb: I think you showed me that link before at some point in the past. We simply don't have any place to put units like that without being able to put them in a rack. I checked and saw only two products by them, unfortunately.

[ This Message was edited by: takieda on 2005-07-24 09:14 ]

takieda · Post by **takieda** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:16 am

On an aside, Arkadin, those two products have now raised the question of whether or not I need EQs and/or Compressors for the mics in the studio, or if Scope can handle all that work itself.

takieda · Post by **takieda** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:25 am

Nevermind this message, my father doesn't want the focusrite unit, and has decided to opt for something with an EQ at the least, if not a compressor as well. (it was for a Focusrite Red 1 unit which is WAY too expensive, but was just right, or so I thought)

[ This Message was edited by: takieda on 2005-07-24 09:44 ]

takieda · Post by **takieda** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:42 am

Well I've talked it over with my father and he's actually likes the ACT-2 unit, as even though the Scope can do this stuff, setting things right for the environment and leaving them that way is preferable to having to set it every time you set up a new project. He also likes the VU meter. We're not buying just yet, it is a bit pricy.

So is there anything competing with the ACT-2 product? I.E. any 2 channel compressor, EQ, mic-pre with phantom power?

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 10:16 am

On the EQ issue, the Toft is based on the EQ strips he's developed for Trident desks since the beginning of time, so you know you're getting a decent, not run-of-the-mill, EQ. Apparently Tony Visconti loves them which is no bad recommendation. Check here.

In my opinion these channels are priced about half their actual value due to Chinese manufacture i believe, so if you have any moral problems with that best to know now - although everything seems to be made in China nowadays so i don't see an issue myself.

Mr A

Post by **garyb** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 11:00 am

why can't you use the rnps on a rack shelf? they're designed to fit 3 on a shelf. eq is your choice. that eq being discussed is excellent and well worth owning, although i agree, eq is usually not needed on iput, better to choose the right mic and pre than eq... there is NO BEST mic pre! there is only the one you like for a particular job or the one(s) you own.

[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2005-07-24 12:03 ]

takieda · Post by **takieda** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 11:45 am

Arkadin: I don't think there's a problem with the chinese manufacturing, unless it's honestly lower quality. At this point, we want the best studio equipment we can get for the lowest price. My father actually thinks the Focusrite Red 1 module is excellent, but still too pricy, and the lack of the EQ is a point against it because he's starting to like the ACT-2

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 12:30 pm

To be honest i would record any sources 'flat', possibly with a little compression, and EQ after if needed, so i'm not so sure EQ should be an issue, unless your father has some tried and tested methods he likes to use.

Of course, if you EQ afterwards you either have to do it in SCOPE (thereby negating the need for EQ on the Pre) or you have to send the signal out of SCOPE back into the ATC (or whatever), and then back into SCOPE. As you have the A16 this shouldn't be too much of a problem.

As to build quality, i'm pretty sure that they're OK, it's just cheaper labour costs.

If you don't know Malcolm Toft, check this SOS article.

[ This Message was edited by: Mr Arkadin on 2005-07-24 13:35 ]

takieda · Post by **takieda** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 1:33 pm

Well my father's statement on using an EQ before Scope was that we have a special audio chamber (inside a boat) and to properly EQ it in this boat is a good idea, esp. if it can be set and just left that way. That way, when it goes into scope, it's already EQ'd to flat response, or whatever (I'm more of a computer technician than a musician, so I'm learning all this stuff as I go). So if he wants to do anything in scope, he's already got the same signal to work with he has for any other work he does while in this studio. I *think* that's the basis of what he said. I'm not honestly sure if he wants/needs the Compressor, as the only comment I heard him say about why he wanted the ACT-2 instead of the cheaper model was that he liked the VU Meters (I'm sure there's more going on in his head - but that's what he said to me).

garyb: I was not aware that those units could be placed inside a rack shelf like that. I'll mention it to him when he returns to see what he says. There is still the fact that he likes the idea of a real EQ setup, so we may still just go with that.