Minimonsta

Post by **garyb** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 3:54 pm

certainly native can sound as good as dsp. how cpu hungry will that be? afai can see, the minimonsta is a resource hog. you won't be running much else with that going....

interloper · Post by **interloper** » Sun Feb 27, 2005 2:12 pm

Definitely. But the CPU overhead will go down in time, as more sophisticated Operating Systems utillize resources more efficiently.

I've got 3 boards. I'll never have less than 3 in my machine, until the PCI bus is no longer available on this earth.

I do think Scope has it's own sound, as does the UAD-1, but I think Creamware needs to reinvest in marketing this platform. Quickly.

As a company in this space, you are only good as your last success.

Man-Machine · Post by **Man-Machine** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 1:47 am

On 2005-02-25 08:59, r_Daneel Olivaw wrote:
I own minimax and minimonsta, and to me they are two top notch synths, noone of them being better.
Minimax rules for classic solid/funky bass lines, where monsta rules for everything else. The melohman feature is the best tool EVER for crazy expressivity morphing : morphing between completely different patches via a dedicated keyboard octave is so powerful and user friendly ! And remember almost all the parameters of the monsta can be modulated with a DEDICATED lfo and adsr ! this feature alone makes Max and Monsta two really different beasts.
At kvr they are in the "who's the most accurate simulation?" controversy, which is wasting time because two different minimoogs do never sound the same...
But for sure arturia's modeled mini sounded very bad
To me Max and Monsta are two very good different tools I have in my arsenal.
Native synths and CW are equal quality now (btw oddity is far better than prodyssey).But there is still a big difference between the two worlds : try to play 12 M:M notes in a daw...

Two top notch synths, sure...but you're wrong about wasting time making comparisons. The moment a company claims it's synth emulates another then comparisons NEED TO be made. The M:M is not as good in bass as the Minimax or Minimoog. Even Arturia does it better. Just check them on a spectrum analyser and you'll see it if your ears can't hear it. Bass is one thing that Minimoog is famous for so it's a VERY important feature to emulate if they claim it emulates a Minimoog. Whoever is using the Minimax as a bass synth will NOT find the Minimonsta as a replacement...

R.D. Olivaw · Post by **R.D. Olivaw** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:58 am

but you're wrong about wasting time making comparisons. The moment a company claims it's synth emulates another then comparisons NEED TO be made.

of course we can make such comparisons on forums. But i wanted to point out the fact that Creamware, Ohmforce, and Arturia did not emulate the same synth, i mean not the same unit. And that makes a huge difference coz we're talking about old pure analogic units. So to people saying "it's weird, the filter knob does not behave the same way on max and on monsta, but they both are mini, so who's wrong?" i want to answer : noone. different synths different pleasures.

see ya

decimator · Post by **decimator** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:58 am

Sorry r_Daneel Olivaw but some of your affirmations made me jump off my chair !
First if you already own Minimonsta, you must be a tester I guess ?
Minimax only rules at basslines and Minimonsta at everything else ?
Oddity is far better than Prodyssey ?
I have no real memory of my testing of Oddity ( warmer sound that's all I remember ) I spent 3 hours on Minimonsta and I give up ...
I'am just pro quality ( sound and sonic range ) unregarding I admit of the accuracy of an emulation but if there's no obvious gaps anymore why not just having Reaktor instead : plenty of emulations there.

Music Manic · Post by **Music Manic** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:25 am

Symbiote I value your responses.
Could you tell us which way Creamware needs to go,for the need of us.

Thanks

Man-Machine · Post by **Man-Machine** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:53 am

On 2005-02-28 07:58, r_Daneel Olivaw wrote:

of course we can make such comparisons on forums. But i wanted to point out the fact that Creamware, Ohmforce, and Arturia did not emulate the same synth, i mean not the same unit. And that makes a huge difference coz we're talking about old pure analogic units. So to people saying "it's weird, the filter knob does not behave the same way on max and on monsta, but they both are mini, so who's wrong?" i want to answer : noone. different synths different pleasures.

see ya

I understand that there's is a variation range from Minimoog to Minimoog but still all of them can do bass equally good and the Minimonsta can't...

Also, how can you compare the Oddity with the Prodissey after what you just said? These guys emulate completely different revisions of the Oddyssey with complete different filters?

_________________
L8ter Oscill8ters!

[ This Message was edited by: Man-Machine on 2005-02-28 10:58 ]

[ This Message was edited by: Man-Machine on 2005-02-28 11:02 ]

R.D. Olivaw · Post by **R.D. Olivaw** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 2:04 pm

On 2005-02-28 09:58, decimator wrote:
Sorry r_Daneel Olivaw but some of your affirmations made me jump off my chair !
First if you already own Minimonsta, you must be a tester I guess ?
Minimax only rules at basslines and Minimonsta at everything else ?
Oddity is far better than Prodyssey ?
I have no real memory of my testing of Oddity ( warmer sound that's all I remember ) I spent 3 hours on Minimonsta and I give up ...
I'am just pro quality ( sound and sonic range ) unregarding I admit of the accuracy of an emulation but if there's no obvious gaps anymore why not just having Reaktor instead : plenty of emulations there.

yes i'm a betatester.
i *prefer* basslines with max and everything else with monsta, but that's only a matter of artistic taste. And the melohman abilities of the monsta are always a plus to me, to make expressive sounds quickly.
But that's a matter of taste, it depends on many factors, like the music u make, etc. Everyone should decide on its own.
I repeat, Oddity is a more accurate emulation than the Prodissey, and i'm not talking about subtles differences because of different hardware versions emulated. Prodyssey is not duophonic, and some of the controls on it do absolutely not behave the way they do on a real Odissey. But i love Prodissey sound too, CW just shouldn't give this synth such a name and such a skin. To me Odissey means duophonic sound.
But there's no polemic here. Everyone will have his own preferences, choosing with his own ears, in his own setup, for his own project.

regards

R.D. Olivaw · Post by **R.D. Olivaw** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 2:46 pm

On 2005-02-28 10:53, Man-Machine wrote:

I understand that there's is a variation range from Minimoog to Minimoog but still all of them can do bass equally good and the Minimonsta can't...

If you're saying Max & Arturia's can do bass sound equally good, let me tell you how much i disagree. I just hate Arturia's, where I love Max. But that's a matter of taste (as usual...), I don't need any fft analyser to test an audio instrument, thank you...
And m:m can do a good bass sound. You said it can't, i answer i already heard awesome classic funky basslines made with m:m. Should be a matter of taste here again...

Also, how can you compare the Oddity with the Prodissey after what you just said? These guys emulate completely different revisions of the Oddyssey with complete different filters?

See my previous post. Prodissey is not an accurate Odissey emulation, though a very good sounding soft synth.

regards

Man-Machine · Post by **Man-Machine** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:11 pm

People, this is very easy to understand. It's not an opinion, it's a fact. It can be measured. A synth either reach certain frequencies or not. Just put the MiniMonsta to the test and you'll see where it sits in the spectrum.

Basses are one of the things a Minimoog is known for so it's VERY important to emulate it, right? It counts a lot more than the 0.00001% mentioned. 80% of the hiphop producers out there are still using Minimoogs for bass sounds. So if you look at this aspect the Minimonsta does not do what it claims and cannot be used in this manner. We're NOT talking about machine to machine difference here. It's a basic aspect that ALL Minimoogs have that the Minimonsta doesn't. Sure, it's just one little thing but its a big dea! It should've been one of the top priority things to emulate...

_________________
L8ter Oscill8ters!

[ This Message was edited by: Man-Machine on 2005-02-28 16:12 ]

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:57 pm

I gotta say I agree. I was fairly impressed by the analog-ish character of the Minimonsta, but the bass end is not there really. To be honest though, I don't think the Minimax has it either (although it is definitely better). I'm comparing it to the Studio Electronics SE1 which is basically a Minimoog with a few (nice) extras (this is the Mini replica which is used by soooo many hip hop/r+b guys).

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:29 pm

This is a very subjective topic when going by 'ear', as we all have slight variences in our hearing capabilities.

Technically, one instrument will always sound different to another, just as it/they will 'sound' to different to someone else's 'ear'.

To my old ears, the Minimax sounds absolutely wonderfull & very much like the originals.

I find that Vinco can be used to add just the right warmth. Minimax then needs very little bass treatment & sounds wonderfull as a partner to an original mini, modular or whatever.

I'm off for a listen !!
Best regards
Bob

nprime · Post by **nprime** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:35 pm

Really? Bob Moog for real? Here on our little forum?

If it's really you, then what an honor to have you on board.

R

[ This Message was edited by: nprime on 2005-02-28 17:35 ]

Man-Machine · Post by **Man-Machine** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:38 pm

You're right, most of Studio Electronics customers are into hiphop and R&B styles. The SE1x is slowly replacing the Minis out in that community because it's newer, warranty, more features, etc. but you still get that mini bass sound.

The Minimonsta is a good analogue sounding softsynth but it just doens't have that Mini bass sound. This must be one of those tough to emulate characteristics of analogue synths...

nprime · Post by **nprime** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:26 pm

I own a Prophet 5, and none of the emulations deliver that down and dirty analogue fatness, that's why people will still rent it to get "that" sound on a song.

However, I have been experimenting with the Modular II lately and I have to say that I have found some very fat sounds on it.

R

R.D. Olivaw · Post by **R.D. Olivaw** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:31 pm

On 2005-02-28 16:11, Man-Machine wrote:
People, this is very easy to understand. It's not an opinion, it's a fact. It can be measured. A synth either reach certain frequencies or not. Just put the MiniMonsta to the test and you'll see where it sits in the spectrum.

So please make those tests before spreading it's a fact.
I personnally assisted to such tests (with an ohmforce dsp designer), A/B'ing different mini emulations, i saw the analyses of sweeping filters etc, and let me tell you the monsta produces an extremely rich audio spectrum. What's your tool to analyse spectrum? Did you make a real test?

If you think monsta cannot get "that mini bass sound", right. But it's not a fact, it's a point of view, because "that mini bass sound" isn't that precise...
The only fact is that everyone can download the m:m demo & decide by himself.

btw the SE1x is a great synth!

regards

[ This Message was edited by: r_Daneel Olivaw on 2005-02-28 19:31 ]

symbiote · Post by **symbiote** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:30 pm

Poor workers blame their too.. wait nevermind

BTW, to answer Man-Machine's question, I think Creamware should go this way >>

<< Or maybe it was that way?

As long as they're going somewhere

obOnTopic: well, if you like the Mini, get both, so you can load up MiniMax when you are short on DSP, and load up Monsta when DSP is full but CPU is spare, and have the luxury of having 20-25 voices of Mini, thus gaining the much-coveted Room-Full of Minimoogs for a completely mindboggling fraction of the price (and much less space too) of an actual room full of hardware moogz. See, no problem!

[ This Message was edited by: symbiote on 2005-02-28 20:47 ]

Man-Machine · Post by **Man-Machine** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 12:01 am

So please make those tests before spreading it's a fact.

If you think monsta cannot get "that mini bass sound", right. But it's not a fact, it's a point of view, because "that mini bass sound" isn't that precise...
The only fact is that everyone can download the m:m demo & decide by himself.

btw the SE1x is a great synth!

regards

I already did

(along with other people from KVR forum) The files are there to be downloaded with full spectrum bmp too...so yes, it's a fact. Don't get me wrong, the Minimonsta it's a very good synth and I think it's the best current native Minimoog emulation. It just doesn't have that bottom end that ALL Minis have. That part of Minimoogs is ALWAYS precise. If you spend a long time with a real Mini you'll know what I'm talking about...

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 12:28 am

You can make a recording which sounds like a room full of Minimoogs with one Moog, real or not, because as always, it's not 'what you have', but rather, 'what you do with it' that counts.

Surely ?

Creamware however, have captured the true sound, sense & feel of the mini. No dought.

.....and the Noah is simply sublime

regards,
Bob

suthnear · Post by **suthnear** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:40 am

On 2005-03-01 00:01, Man-Machine wrote:
I already did (along with other people from KVR forum) The files are there to be downloaded with full spectrum bmp too...

Where's that full spectrum bmp? I assume you're referring to this thread:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=76613
But I don't see any bmps there...