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This file has expired and is no longer available here. The owner of the topic can re-upload the file, or post a link to an off-site file. <BR><BR><a name="planetz-tag"></a>Genre: Acoustic<BR> <a name="planetz-tag"></a>Uses: Pulsar Mixers<BR> copyright © 2002 kensuguro<BR> _____________________________________<BR><BR> I'm going to feature the Chinese wooden flute for my upcoming theater project and I'm in the process of practicing it. I did this little tune to see just how oriental, nostalgic, and big I could get things to sound. No mixing yet tho. I basically just put it together with pulsar mixer and added some verb. Maybe I might use this motif for the real thing, maybe not. I like it tho, it's definitely got a nostaligic character.

The tune's supposed to be Japanese.. or chinese.. oriental, whichever. (which is your first impression?) Funny thing is, it's even hard for us Japanese people to tell. Anyway, my flute plyaing sucked today and I just couldn't get the high registers.. I can when I'm not recording, but with the strings, it just didn't work. (half the fun with real instruments) Anything you think I should consider while practicing? It's basically just a flute made of bamboo that only does whole notes. Some of the notes are obviously off tune.. dunno why, maybe bad craftsmanship.

Ha... and before anyone mensions it.. I already DID try digitising the instrument.. with total un-success. There's just waay too much sound variation it's impossible to get a constant sound throughout the scale. Main problem is breath noise.. They make even the minute phase shifts obvious. Maybe I just need more practice tho.

Hey, but don't you think it's pretty good for just 3 weeks? (and I've never blown a flute before) I'm also going to get a Hichiliki, or some sort of Japanese double reed instrument. Great Japanese/Chinese mix, just like me, half Chinese half Japanese. Music really does reflect the composer's personality doesn't it?

I don't know how austere you need your piece to be, but realism wants a bit more ornamentation on the flute. Quarter tone pitch bends here, semi-tone pitch bends there...you know what I mean.

I do love this type of music. I easily get lost in it. Better than drugs

Ornamentation... that's something I'm working on right now. I'm working on my pitch bends.. not sure if I can go as far as a quarter note. It seems the instrument is asking for a quarter note up. Down is almost impossible. Anyway, that's some more practice for me!

BTW, how d'you like the strings arrangement? I thought they were a bit cliche, but worked ok in bringing out the "good old methods" feel. A little suspend here and there.

hi kensuguro,just to say that even if it is an asian ambience,it easy can be a kind of Ennio Morricone movement(a kind of big japanese western maybe?)he he.

here in antwerp, we have this open air film festival in the summer, on the river bank. every year there's another theme (film & decoration). two years ago the theme was the 'silk route' ... all oriental movies. yeah, this certainly would be good for the atmosphere i was soaked in when watching these movies. can't wait for it's final version.

Practicing Pitch bends...

An idea: Why don't you play full 1-tone bends and compress them when needed? I do this a lot, I play 1-tone bends and then compress them to a semi-tone bend when needed. It should then be child's play to further compress, eh? The bends sound really weird when I do this but , having done it a long time, I can actually abstract (hear) the real notes that are going to result from the operation.

What do you think?

_________________
Paul R. Martin

I think I may get the hang of this after all!

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: paulrmartin on 2002-03-20 05:03 ]</font>

Paulmartin, I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "compress". But I found out that I could simply pitch bend up, buy slowly shifting my finger to the side of the hole. And I can get "fake" half notes by covering half the whole. Not much use cuz it's too hard to aim for a perfect half.. but useful for "blue" notes.

Hey, by the way, I got the reed instrument and also got a Japanese flute! And I suck at both of them!

The reed inst, called Hichiliki, sounds much like a soprano sax because the reed shape is very similar. But it's very short, like 25cm long, so a lot of the pitch is controled with reed pressure. I can go almost 1 whole note up and down. It's been a while since I've blown my last reed instrument, so my emboschures need some serious working out.

The japanese flute, called Ryuteki, is a whole new deal.. It's almost half the size of a standard flute.. but the hole to blow into is almost 5 times as large!! You can almost stick your finger in there! And that means, MEGA air. You need to blow so much air into it to get sound, by the time you finish a couple tones, you're dead out of oxygen. My head aches when I practice this instrument.

And now I know that either of these instruments take super human abilities to master.. it's no wonder we don't see too much of them anywhere. Even in Japan!
Anyway, practice, practice.

Oh yeah, and something I had forgotten about real instruments... they have hard wired scales! The chinese flute's in C (thank god), but Hichiliki is in G, and Ryuteki is.. well, I'll need to be able get sound out of it first. And they all have certain notes that are definitely off tune because of physical properties.. Man, as a trade off for expression and tonal variation, you get all these imperfections..

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: kensuguro on 2002-03-20 09:19 ]</font>

Silly me!
Here I am talking samples and MIDI manipulation and you're playing the REAL DEAL!

Maybe EWI might come up with an electronic Hichiliki(I always thought it was called hichiRiki, after studying Gagaku by Messiaen...)

_________________
Paul R. Martin

I think I may get the hang of this after all!

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: paulrmartin on 2002-03-20 10:15 ]</font>

ohh, ya got me paul.. I definitely need more practicing.. I was wondering what you meant by "realism wants" when I can't get more real that.. uh, REAL! Anyway, more ornamentation should do it.

And I'm surprised you've studied Gagaku! Hichiliki, hichiriki, would work both ways. Heck, I need to start studying too. The learning curve of the instruments is just SO steep! Haven't seen anything like it. Getting no sound is just too tough.

i can't flaw the flute playing,(good job on a new instrument!)the melody is very nice and the orchestra is very appropriate.there is something in zen which is...patient.calm.and comfortable in were things ARE.you know, a connection to creation.this subtlety is the only thing i would look for to have something really sound japanese or chinese.that unrushed yet alert and unlazy(AWARE) quality.
well, off to work.thanks for the nice tune to hum.

pretty cool, you have a pretty good mic!
the music doesn't sound very japanese but very chinese style.
i like SENS's stuff, a multicultural feeling(to me) by using chinese, japanese, and wastern insturments/styles!

Hello Ken! The melody is beautiful, if I was you I would definitely use this very one to work with. It has a lot of possibilities.

The arrangement it's very nice as well but I noticed there is a wrong chord, harmonically speaking, just by the end of one of the musical phrases. I mean, it is perhaps something you want, I don't know, but it's feels strange cos the arrangement gets stack in a deficient of harmony definition. It is a very classical arrangement and this chord to my understanding, is not helping the beauty of the whole song.

I don't like much the kind of strings you are using, I think they are too muscular, your melody is so beautiful that I would like something much softer and INTIMATE, something sounding more like the Japanese spirit of romanticism. I would like it to be slightly slower as well and played not so rhythmically in tempo but entering your own “Japanese heart” to express it with all your intention.

The sound you are pooling out of the “cane” is more than acceptable for somebody just starting studding it. Congratulations for that, really a good work! Don't worry about the air sound, it's part of the beauty of the sound itself. You have a natural talent for it, I'm not kidding at all, those are very difficult instruments to play and I know that.

Finally, I would very much like something magical sort of a light atmosphere behind it, but almost not perceivable, perhaps with bells or something percussive.

I've been extremely interested in Chinese philosophy and music for ages; have many Chinese friends as well.

Hope to have helped a bit in your search for this perfect song.

Oh... harmonic efficiency. That's a very good word.
Anyway, I'll still be looking over the harmonization before I enter the "real" composition stage. I'll still be adding tempo changes and others to give it a more "flowing" feel. Thanx for pointing that out.

Oh well, I've got to get back to practising. Practise, practise, practise. I've got the flute, hichiriki, sho (the accordion's grandfather), biwa (guitar's grandfather) to practise... Man, I'm just in love with real instruments now. I guess it's some sort of a "growth" phase that I've been waiting close to 3 years for.

Hi Ken... This is definetely the POINT to warm up our compositions: REAL INSTRUMENTS!!! I coul'nt agree more with you!!! I whish I had the money to buy a few righ now!