PlanetZ forums - scopeusers.com

hubird wrote:

dante wrote:

hubird wrote: Xite-1 is on the list, but useless 'Scope Open Source' is obviously more important for S/C than OSX, which is us promised since the year zero.

I would have thought that if OSX support eventuates, it would be because of Open Scope, not despite it.

rightly commented I guess, the thing is that I prefer such elementary things done by the company itself, rather than waiting for a third party initiative without much company obligations.
I don't even know if it's possible at all, as I don't have a clue what's possible actually.
I just want is stable and compatible.
Astro often commented that it not just an overnight thing to make Scope supporting OSX.
In the meantime we saw great CW/SC programmers step over to other partners in the market,

Resulting question: what's the chance that OSX will be supported very soon?
Anyone who wants to shine some light on it?
edit: nevermind, it's rather OT

i guess this is where i pipe in as my Sonic|Core persona. way the heck off topic in an off topic forum....

too bad for what you would prefer. if it were possible, it would have been done. Holger is a man who definitely cares about doing a good job.

soon? as in 6 months? unlikely.
soon, as in 12-18 months? could be, it depends on what happens in the next 6 months, and it wouldn't NECESSARILY depend on 3rd parties. no one knows for sure how things will work out. S|C will continue to work to move the platform forward as quickly as possible.

windows 7 took 2 1/2 years and most all of S|C's resources. it's easy to demand obvious things that one wants without knowing what the reality is. there's no reason for S|C to detail the ups and downs of life. the fact that they keep working to improve the product indicates the good faith required. OSX is a big job, made much smaller by v6, because v6's elements are all cross platform. only the actual instructions to the os need be modified and only a driver need be written. this is all connected to Scope being made open-source. OSX support is something that S|C would offer NOW if it was possible.

currently, writing Scope for another os is not just writing a driver, it's also rewriting most of the program, which creates all kinds of issues.

the following part is not official, it's my personal commentary.
the reason you see great Scope programmers working for others is:
1. in the original Creamware insolvancy, everyone was fired and
2. those people all needed to make money. it's great for the whole computer music world that these greatest programmers in the business can help others.
3. since S|C is not Creamware, most of the important coders work freelance on S|C projects. otherwise, there are a few talented people involved in Scope's production. with more sales, more people could be employed. guys like Julian, Holger(who headed the original developement team) and Ralf Dressel(who knows Scope better than anyone) are more than capable of producing whatever needs to be produced. it's insane to expect them to work faster when they are already working miracles. yes, miracles.....if you love Scope, you know what i mean. if you don't love Scope, you're in the wrong chatroom.

'Those that are not developers complain the most'. The consumer is finicky.

- quote from famous engineer/developer (processor guru) at Intel back in the 90's (who will remain nameless). <now deceased>

OSX will come - but you should ask why this is such a critical step in working with Scope?

If I tell people that I've had rock-solid performance with Win7/Xite for nearly 3 years now, and that 95% of the program works here (I don't care about XTC), and that my Xite has paid for itself many times over, then why is this not a determiner rather than waiting on yet one more thing, one more thing, one more thing - and THEN I'll get music done?

We have the tools of kings at our fingertips, we should feel blessed.

I can remember hanging strips of board-tape on the wall, and having to keep log books of session settings. I still have a scar or two from cutting tape with razors. I count my blessings every day.

The past is WAY gone.

Greg

As a developer myself working to hugely unrealistic expectations from those that pay the bills and those that dont, I fully grok S|C's position. Open Scope is at least as strategic as it is tactical.

it's a move in a direction that allows for a future that has all the things we would want from this system.

I fully agree with Greg's comment, it's better to use the available tools now...
there was a huge difference when Apple made their very own operating system, but OSX isn't a conceptual breakthrough at all - it's good old unix...
Sure, it can run very stable, but anyone keeping the usual internet rubbish from his or her Windoze box will experience the same.

Regarding Sonic Core I'm absolutely convinced they had the very best intentionions when announcing OSX support.
But they probably underestimated the 'new complexity' in Apple's mode of operation.
Imo a company of their manpower just can't keep up with the mess, imagine the changes between Leopard, Snow Leopard and Lion... and no end in sight...
Small developers are completely locked out from the low level stuff, leaving 'Apps' as the only option that makes economic sense.

cheers, Tom

OSX is experiencing a backlash outside of larger studios atm anyway. While it's unfortunate to make promises that are hard to fulfill, it's certainly more important to attend to the core business (existing market of customers etc) rather than overextending the company and having issues again. A sonic core sans OSX support is still better releasing a major release and having financial difficulties again imo.

thanks for the new thread Garyb.

hm, when I read you guys I don't see much hope for OSX support in a reasonable period of time.
There's always a new Windows nr.## on the roll demanding all the manpower, and as app I won't use it.

BTW, I don't blame the developers who moved their jobs, at least that was not my intention when I memorized them.
Yet their depart makes OSX more unlikely of course.

I still run my cards on a Quicksilver mac with OS9, but I had to replace my old broken Quicksilver already for another oldie.
The setup with two macs runs fine, and all together my combo offers more inputs than an Xite-1.
Yet I would like to buy an Xite (together with an Intel mac), but not without OSX support.
A switch to pc isn't my cup of tea, but that's personal
Do I still have to press Start if I wanne shut down the pc?

Yes, it's something I always found odd, but I use a PL8+ and use the sequential shutdown as that bothers me too.
I remember my first build, GaryV would say, just n ake sure you go to Start and shut it down..........wtf....?

I very rarely turn it off, but when i do it takes just one quick press of the power button! Amazing technology

hubird wrote: Do I still have to press Start if I wanne shut down the pc?

Well it's been a while since I used OS9, but seem to remember I had to go to "Special" to shut down and had to drag floppies into the Trash Can to eject them! All platforms have their quirks if you're not used to them.

I must say I cannot see a negative to Open Scope. I don't think it's there to allow S|C to become lazy in development.