New Physical Modelling Rhodes

[astroman]

imho the OTR 88 is the most convincing and best tunable device of it's kind.
Every parameter is tweakable for each single key, but you might as well tweak a single parameter for all keys by drawing with the mouse - a smart approach.
You could even fake an existing instrument key by key without sampling

Worth checking for developers, too - regarding the GUI approach

cheers, Tom

[dawman]

It does have a nice GUI.
Modartt is actually incorporating that in their next " Pro " version too.
It is necessary IMO as when you get global parameters only, they hardly can be applied across such a wide range of frequencies.
A good example is what is called string stretching in PianoTeq 3.0 by Modartt.
While it allows a very convincing amount of false beats ( triple string detuning ) to be applied in the upper octaves, which makes it sound very authentic, that same effect carried down to the lower octaves is unnaturual sounding, well actually it sounds like crap.

I downloaded the demo, and can finally say after 3 1/2 years of agreeing with everything you ever say, I can finally respectfully disagree.........
This is cool as an electric Piano, but it sounds as if it were in a can even w/o effects.
The price is too high.
The effects are weak.
And the sounds are unconvincing, just like every other PhysMod I have bought. I have 3 of them, and PhysMods have a better touch to them, but they still don't sound as good as Scarbee's Rhodes. I have disloyally tried LoungeLizz, Modartt, Ray, Logics Mac Plug and 2 or 3 other ones and they all suck.

One thing though is these guys are ahead of the game and have a great chance to be the go to plug, but they really need to get a real Fender Rhodes and Wurlitzer, and sit down and listen to someone play it in all registers.
They have the Middle C and 2 octaves up pretty close, but the high end bellish tones are missing, and the hard velocity bark, as well as the low end tine sound.
But I am an asshole about these instruments, I used the real ones for years.
I have a great Wurlitzer and Rhodes, but no combo organ or D6 Clavinet after 25 years I find it truly pathetic that developers can't get these basic instruments to sound convincing. I heard Scarbee's D6 Clavinet but I would have to disable tons of release samples as they are way overdone. It seems that developers are more concerned with these release samples that can hardly be heard in a band context, and only on a song like Superstition can you hear Stevie Wonder stacattoing the notes perfectly and even then the release sounds blend with the original notes. Sampler developers make these two sound almost seperate and always way to loud just to show you they knew a slight release exisited. Same way I use to use my first hardware reverb..... . Hell I paid 2500 USD for it and I wanted to hear it !!

For a little less money one could buy the Modartt PianoTeq 3.0 and have a great sounding and playing Piano, and a passable Rhodes and Wurlitzer.
These guys have a great start though, and I will be watching to see if they upgrade it, or have a BETA forum with a bunch of old bastards like me and listen to our critiques.

[astroman]

... I downloaded the demo, and can finally say after 3 1/2 years of agreeing with everything you ever say, I can finally respectfully disagree.........

let's face it - it had to happen... sooner or later...

...This is cool as an electric Piano, but it sounds as if it were in a can even w/o effects.
The price is too high.
The effects are weak.
And the sounds are unconvincing, just like every other PhysMod I have bought. ...

They have the Middle C and 2 octaves up pretty close, but the high end bellish tones are missing, and the hard velocity bark, as well as the low end tine sound.
But I am an asshole about these instruments, I used the real ones for years...

I agree about the effects, but I wouldn't mind the slightly 'narrow' and too clean base tone, tho.
After all a tine is a kind of pitchfork, more or less - proper amp processing applies...
I've sent it through Celmo's Bass Amp for a quick result which provided a less artificial sound.

I always liked the instrument (Corea and Hancock come to mind), but never had a real Rhodes myself - regrettably... but I found this way more convincing than EVP88, which probably was turned into the Logic Plugin after Apple's purchase.
Faking a soundgenerator with such a highly specific mechanic (like the Rhodes) can only be a compromise, as it's part of the sound generation itself.

But imho you underestimate the tuning range.
Just like you, I didn't find a fully convincing preset, but the degree of customization is amazing - and it's easy to tweak.
Each of the 17 parameters can be setup per key or per range of keys.

Can't comment about 'live' playing, but as far as recording is concerned noone will tell this from the real thing (even less in a mix) if it's properly setup.
The price is reasonable imho, they have to include piracy in their calculation...
Even for 50 bucks the majority of folks would use the illegal copy instead.

cheers, Tom

[Shroomz~>]

Would love to hear it played through dynatube or mogo then thru B2003.

Off to bed now.

[braincell]

It's pointless to complain about effects since you already have good effects. You want it to blend with your other instruments anyway.

[dawman]

I am complaining about wasted resources. These effects can be disabled, but they still remain on line when loaded and use IPS's of the CPU.
This is exactly why I avoid most VSTi's. It's a trend of medocrity and convenience.

Instead of a real Pan where 2 speakers have their SPL levels raised and lowered from speaker to speaker, most developers never having played a real Satellite Rhodes throw in some lame vibrato or tremolo. Only jerk offs like me notice this though, and PC musicians just seem to be happier with excessive gadgets to tweak with.

To me the details are a reflection of the pride and experience of the developer.
With the sheer amount of power of modern day CPU's and DSP's there's no excuse for corner cutting anymore.

This is a really decent plug though, I just think they need to do a little more than listen to a recording of the instrument they emulate. They should listen to the recording of a stupid pop song called Baby Come Back. It demonstrates what every developer keeps missing.
The left hand plays a warm medium velocity chord which avoids the bellish sound, and at the same time the right hand uses a very light touch which emphasizes the beuatiful bell tones descending....

These details are what makes the Rhodes so desirable.

All these guys need to do is have a public BETA and listen to the customers, or people BETA testing it. Modartt did this and it worked well. Even though they still don't have it down, it did go from a peice of shit emulation to a passable model. Once they apply the GUI and note for note editing that the above instrument has, it will be quite an instrument.

I do applaud the developer of this though, as he is a large step ahead of the pack with his editing and GUI. They only need the extra tones I mentioned, and use the resources of the CPU for that....

Peace & Incense..

[braincell]

VST and VSTi are automatically turned off in Cubase when not in use. That is why I *only* use VST effects.

[dawman]

VST and VSTi are automatically turned off in Cubase when not in use. That is why I *only* use VST effects.

Don't worry Brotha' Man, there'll be a mini XITE-1 before long to ease your suffering......

[Shroomz~>]

Don't worry Brotha' Man, there'll be a mini XITE-1 before long to ease your suffering......

[valis]

VST and VSTi are automatically turned off in Cubase when not in use. That is why I *only* use VST effects.

Jimmy is (I think) referring to the fact that even if you bypass an effect in a plugin, when that plugin does its calculation it at the very least has some code in memory that deals with the fact that the effects are 'disabled', versus not having the effects at all. He's not talking about when the VSTi is making no sound at all, but rather making sound with bypassed internal fx.

[eric]

This is a really decent plug though, I just think they need to do a little more than listen to a recording of the instrument they emulate. They should listen to the recording of a stupid pop song called Baby Come Back. It demonstrates what every developer keeps missing.
The left hand plays a warm medium velocity chord which avoids the bellish sound, and at the same time the right hand uses a very light touch which emphasizes the beuatiful bell tones descending....

This should be achievable with simple velocity layering.
I used to tune my own 73 and have scoped (oscilloscope that is) the output of each pickup. Also used a frequency counter for nominal tune. The pitch changes slightly as the tine vibration diminishes. It's a complex beast to model. Not to mention the little tuning springs that make the tine non-liear in different ways on different notes.

Eric.

[sonolive]

hi all,

amazing electric pianos for SC dsp cards here ...

http://forums.planetz.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=27357

cheerz
olive