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siriusbliss wrote:Sorry, but the ideological totalitarian state will not work, has NOT EVER worked - (Nazi Germany, USSR, etc.),

Greg, you forgot to add Nazi America!!

<~Shroomz~> wrote:

siriusbliss wrote:Sorry, but the ideological totalitarian state will not work, has NOT EVER worked - (Nazi Germany, USSR, etc.),

Greg, you forgot to add Nazi America!!

No, it's Fascist America. There's a slight difference - although many of the same groups running the show that ran Hitler 80 years ago.

Everything is not in a nice comfy pre-defined box. That way people can't see it.

...and remember that Hitler disarmed the populace first. Hasn't entirely happened here yet.

Greg

Ah, but you're dealing with a different strategy! If you brandish a gun around when the shit hits the fan it'll be a perfect excuse to shoot you.

<~Shroomz~> wrote:Ah, but you're dealing with a different strategy! If you brandish a gun around when the shit hits the fan it'll be a perfect excuse to shoot you.

They'll shoot me much easier if I'm unarmed, uneducated, unaware, brainwashed, fearful, docile, or stupid. That's the whole fine point that needs to be emphasized here. This is not a black and white situation.

Having a gun (or whatever) buys me a little time if/when the shit hits the fan, and people are scrambling for food or property. There won't be time to wait for the 'authorities' that may or may not be under orders counter to your personal security.

Greg

Ok, I'm with you mate.

Maybe I'll move over there. I quite fancy a spell in one of your new concentration camps.

yeah, that's about the size of it.

Won't it be such a rush to try to escape?

<~Shroomz~> wrote:

Won't it be such a rush to try to escape?

yeah, just like on tv.

Oh, come on Gary, you must know I'm only yanking your chain.

c'mon Shroomz, you must know by now that i'm right with you and in good humor!

I see a futue in reality tv for the pair of you.

Quick go copyright that idea, you'll make millions

siriusbliss wrote:[quote=
I'd prefer to just stay healthy and educate myself anyways..

That's not the way it works. Healthy people have to help pay for the sick and people without children have to pay for other peoples children to be educated.

If you feel otherwise, you should be living alone on a desert island somewhere.

The Finns have free college for all. They have better schools and are much more educated than we are. Why do you think they can do it and we can't?

If you don't like the government, you ought not to be living here. In the mean time don't try to ruin it for everyone else by disassembling it. Mend it don't end it!

Fuck guns!

braincell wrote:

siriusbliss wrote:[quote=
I'd prefer to just stay healthy and educate myself anyways..

That's not the way it works. Healthy people have to help pay for the sick and people without children have to pay for other peoples children to be educated.

If you feel otherwise, you should be living alone on a desert island somewhere.

The Finns have free college for all. They have better schools and are much more educated than we are. Why do you think they can do it and we can't?

If you don't like the government, you ought not to be living here. In the mean time don't try to ruin it for everyone else by disassembling it. Mend it don't end it!

Fuck guns!

you really don't get it.
I'm already paying for your lazy ass education and health.
I'm already paying for my sick family member's insurance.
The Finns pay out the yinyang for their Socialized system - so go move there and mooch off them..
I AM mending America - so stop trying to make it out like I'm not.
Wake up and stop trying to make me the fool.
You have ONE braincell left.

Fuck ignorance.

Greg

the government is not god. it is people. everything that people are, the government is. there are bad people and good people in government. the bad people historically, gather the power of government for thier own aims. how can i be against the government? i need it because a technical society requires justice and order. i am not in favor of systems that support the most wicked. i need the government to actually benefit people, not just benefit power hungry people.

if you are going to take the "America, love it or leave it" attitude, braincell, here are a few quotes of what the first president had to say about guns and government.

Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.

George Washington

Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.

George Washington

It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.

George Washington

about the common people owning personal firearms:

The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.

George Washington

The Finns are more happy, healthy and better educated than we are and dare I say it more intelligent.

If everyone can't be trusted with a gun (and we know they can't), then nobody should be allowed to own a gun!

braincell wrote:If everyone can't be trusted with a gun (and we know they can't), then nobody should be allowed to own a gun!

i'm ok with that. no armament for kings, queens, celebrities, governments, private corporate armies, no armament for anyone! is it possible? the official weapons go first.

nice job, braincell, avoiding that minefeild....

Take the weapons away from the people who most frequently use them first. Police officers are required to have months or years of training before they are issued a weapon but for average people (the ones killing everyone) there is no required training at all and no psychological tests.

soldiers have lots of training and they're the people i LEAST want to see up and down my streets carrying guns.

although there are many officers who are really good, the police are notorious for abuse of power and violence. the police in my neighborhood are felons. they are shaved headed steroid junkies. they are NOT more worthy of carrying weapons than i am.

garyb wrote:

c'mon Shroomz, you must know by now that i'm right with you and in good humor!

Never thought otherwise Gary.

It's the product of American extreme individualism mentality, and part of it is also an ideology that guns can protect you from anything. Now, had it been limited to U.S. i wouldn't mind, it's your choice, but you(American foreign policies, since more than 100 years) chose to spread this gospel world wide in order to keep the juice coming in. Face it Gary, it's not some abstract society, You- the U.S. government and U.S. citizens are the Overlords and you are busting the world with you actions and influence. Now you will have a billion dumbass Chinks to follow your example of blind consumerism and man eat man mentality, wanting all the things you have... the war is inevitable it seems. So yeah, grab your gun Gary and pray for the end is near, and stupidity will cause it.
Sorry for being blunt, i have nothing against you or any other participant in this thread.
Although i think you did call me a slave earlier on

Peace