Wordclock

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valis
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Wordclock

Post by valis »

I currently have 4 machines sharing wordclock and adat/aes/spdif connections across them (scope in the middle of 3 RME cards). I'd actually like to add more too, as there are additional machines and soundcards here. I can keep wordclock mostly stable (some of the RME's fall back to 'sync' eventually until resynched) and ADAT is 100% stable (but a poor way to distribute clock across this machine machines imho).

The good part is that I spent some time cleaning out my Scope machine area, swapping cards, and managed to resurrect full ADAT connectivity across both cards. Something I had been lacking since a card failed last November. The downside is that I still find myself wanting improvements....or maybe it's just gas?

In any case thoughts on wordclock source/distrubution? Curious to hear both about live and studio, as I tend to either mirror my setups or build a discrete one for each. Currently I'm just thinking of getting a Black Lion Audio MicroClock MKIII XB Word Clock as it gives me room to add 2 additional bnc slaves over what I'm doing now...
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valis
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Re: Wordclock

Post by valis »

Btw I'm starting to also regret not taking up Dante on the nudge to get an Xite. That day is quickly coming, our PCI cards are clearly aging and I should probably invest forward before the Xite is also reaching its elder years as a product.
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yayajohn
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Re: Wordclock

Post by yayajohn »

Having browsed around quite a bit in the master word clock arena, the Black Lion Mk III was my first choice as well. Seems to have the right amount of features and is reasonably priced. Of course if you fancy trying your luck with a used unit there are lots of options available.
To me, I reasoned that there is a good chance most used units will function just fine for many years to come becoming obsolete by features available only, not in stability. (unless you want to spend a couple of grand on a high end unit)
P.S. You should definitely get an Xite-1. I can guarantee you will not regret it.
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valis
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Re: Wordclock

Post by valis »

Yes, I checked the used market and found several mkI & mkII units, and there's a kit to mod mkII to mkIII. I also researched and found there was an improved firmware for HDSPe raydat cards that has a 'fix' for wordclock falling into 'sync' mode rather than 'lock'. That would work to improve matters (it's a hack on the HDSPe's PLL loop to give it more leeway to track timings) on the RME side, but the MkIII was explicitly listed as also having similar improvements for people who tried it with HDSPe gear.

I am curious what other alternatives there are on the market now as well, it's been a few years since I looked into wordclock and much like everything else there's less need on the broadcast side with digital migrating to networked audio so quickly.
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valis
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Re: Wordclock

Post by valis »

For instance, if I needed more than 6 + SPDIF/AES: [urlhttps://www.grimmaudio.com/pro-products/pro-mas ... s/pro-cc1/]Grimm audio CC1v2[/url]. This stuff is cool, in the past you used a master clock and a distributor, and cabling tolerances were much tighter (using t-connectors and terminators rather than internal termination could make a big difference, especially with longer cable runs).

And it seems that the 5V vs 3.3V standards are no longer as much of an issue (it was sometimes necessary to buffer & convert after the distribution).
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astroman
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Re: Wordclock

Post by astroman »

The older Mutec MC3 (non-plus) with 8 WC, AES and S/PDIF, non reclocking, seems very affordable 2nd hand.
It‘s difficult to google as all the buzz is about the current MC3+ with reclocking capability (w/o USB).
I‘m considering one myself, but I‘m fairly confused by a lot of hype about some products.
How to check quality (except listening) without a lab ???
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valis
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Re: Wordclock

Post by valis »

I have the BLE MkIII XB now, and have wired it up. It did solve the issue that i had with one of my RME cards and scope, which is what I was hoping for.

However unfortunately the rack wars were missing from the box, and the box had no type of seal on it (the official packing box, the outer shipping package was fine) and the unit also has a nasty pot for the frequency selector. It almost feels like they accidentally shipped an open box unit. I talked AMS into shipping me a new unit (I paid for it) and upgrading the shipping to overnight, I'll just swap them when I get the new one tomorrow and if the build quality feels good there just chalk this up to one of those things.

Should I send over some re-clocking tests using silence so we can all a/b/c test the files and see which version of silence we can identify as the BLE clock version? :lol:
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dante
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Re: Wordclock

Post by dante »

valis wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 6:53 am Btw I'm starting to also regret not taking up Dante on the nudge to get an Xite. That day is quickly coming, our PCI cards are clearly aging and I should probably invest forward before the Xite is also reaching its elder years as a product.
Check donations. Lets kick this thing off.
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valis
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Re: Wordclock

Post by valis »

Appreciate that, will have a long way to go (and S|C doesn't have any in stock I believe). I'll put it in escrow to get things started!
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Re: Wordclock

Post by dante »

I’ve been saving $100 a month since the start of the year and now I have enough to get an Xbox series X (also not in stock). So ya gotta start somewhere.
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valis
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Re: Wordclock

Post by valis »

Good point
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astroman
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Re: Wordclock

Post by astroman »

I‘ve found a (fairly) solid compromise that at least does sync Scope properly to the Pro Tools rig:
centerpiece is the Alesis BRC (required as master in Scope anyway for remote VDAT operation).

With Scope only the BRC simply delivers 48khz on the 9pin connection.
With PT active I do a 1-press button switch to set the BRC to external clock input (BNC).
The Adat Bridge (as PT‘s 1st interface) sends project clock to the Alesis BRC, which still sends to Scope via 9pin.
On it’s 2nd out for PT specific Superclock the Adat Bridge syncs Digidesign interfaces.
(this way the Adat Bridge replaces Dididesign‘s Universal Slave Driver)

The system reacts properly to sample rate changes on the PT (MacOS9) side of the system: if some app switches to 44.1khz, Scope follows immediately without major clicks (just regular sound as with Scope‘s control panel).

Monitoring is done via Scope‘s analog output into a V357 (modified impedance converter) that drives my AKG K501.
Unfortunately I had to retire my blue A16 (for the time being), as it has become unreliable (sync issues plus spikes in intervals) :(
But the Korg A880 A/D substitutes at least 8 channels and has the very same 18bit converter/filter design.
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valis
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Re: Wordclock

Post by valis »

Btw, with up to 6 outputs on this clock and 4-5 computers connected at any time, this clock has been great. I am not really interested in how it affects my perception of reverb at -140dBa, but the machines connected to it are completely stable now.

In fact my studio is working well enough that I can easily identify issues and isolate them a lot faster than in years past, and have identified a good % of my gear that needs attention. dynamixii is handling my Scope cards with great speed & care, and I will be sending an RME unit off that is too old to be under warranty, having already replaced it with a used unit from ebay. Other than some aging synths that might cause issues someday, I am very pleased with the current state of things.

In short, the stability of this room has improved with this addition. Very pleased.
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astroman
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Re: Wordclock

Post by astroman »

Similiar experience here on the sync side of things: much better (less annoying) than on TOSlink alone.
If I ever happen to find an affordable unit with both wordclock and superclock, I‘ll switch to that - but atm my ears don‘t tell me it‘s a necessity.
Scope is fine with the BRC as clock source and if communication with Pro Tools is needed I push the BRC’s external sync button and it receives from PT within just a second of resyncing.
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